Contract Change 2021 - Official thread

[Mr Standfast]

14 minutes ago, John Mitchell said:

 

I know what you're getting at, but...

Quite.

 

[Steve F]

Just now, Nathaniel Noir said:

 

Maybe in the UK, in France they just go out to the streets and protest until they get what they want - we should be more like the French.

 

French fishmermen were blockading. Ours wrote a (strongly worded) letter to the government... But let's not go there! 🙃

[John Mitchell]

2 minutes ago, Mr Standfast said:

Quite.

 

 

entropy: gradual decline into disorder

[wilkopix]

37 minutes ago, Alan Gallery said:

I was at the meeting where Alamy slashed the photographer cut from 60% to 50% with the excuse that it would help expand the market in North America which they claimed would be good for everyone. Alamy management went away with our anger ringing in their ears and have never really tried to connect since.  They never did get it that, to us, our photographs are expression, we have pride in the making of them and that they are not just information.  

Oh yes! Thanks for the memory .. I seem to recall the cut was so James West could move to NY and expand that market and we would all be making up the shortfall with a huge increase in sales .. I think I'm still waiting.

[formerly snappyoncalifornia]

7 minutes ago, wilkopix said:

Oh yes! Thanks for the memory .. I seem to recall the cut was so James West could move to NY and expand that market and we would all be making up the shortfall with a huge increase in sales .. I think I'm still waiting.

A couple of years after the NY expansion excuse we were told by James that the NY office was self-sustaining and flourishing. I asked in one of his Q&As since NY was doing so well, would Alamy reinstate the commission cut? It was a funny moment.

Edited May 18, 2021 by formerly snappyoncalifornia

[hotbrightsky]

1 hour ago, Nathaniel Noir said:

 

Ok, thank you for the explanation, I do have a colleague who used to work for DACS, would be a good time to quiz her about things!

 

I informed DACS of Alamy's unfair practices some years ago. They weren't particularly interested at the time. DACS was created to benefit creators, not their agents.

[Doc]

7 hours ago, Gordon Scammell said:

Had an email from Alamy yesterday asking if I would be willing to lift restrictions on an image a customer wanted to buy.  The image is marked as 'No model release' 'No property release'

 

I replied that I would consider it providing I was told what the licence price was.  I am certainly not going to put myself up for legal action for pennies - despite meaningless platitudes from Alamy saying the third party will do this and that regarding rights.  I was then told Alamy cannot divulge finances etc - which i understand.

 

I replied in view of the new contract changes I was not willing to go out of my way to help Alamy make a sale.  Of course I lose out.  But I only lose 40%.  Gave me a little frisson of pleasure to know that Alamy loses 60%.

 

Petty I know - but I'll take my contentment wherever I can.

Yesterday I also had the same request.

 

I too refused to lift the restrictions despite assurances that the purchasers would be "responsible for sourcing any third party rights and they would shoulder all responsibility for using the image. They are currently working with a rights clearance company."

 

My response included the following: 

 

"I understand that the customer says they would shoulder all responsibility for the use if legal problems were to arise, but as I am sure you are aware litigators tend to take a “spatter gun” approach and involve all parties. In addition, whereas a few years ago I would have had some faith that Alamy would support me  as a contributor, I no longer feel that is the case, especially in view of the cynical changes that the new “Contributor Contract” includes, published today."

 

Sadly I have completely lost my belief that Alamy has any interest in its' contributors.

 

Kumar

 

[Gina Kelly]

My first red arrow, for questioning what will happen with the stockimo commission?? Ok, whatever, really hard to care now.

[meanderingemu]

57 minutes ago, John Mitchell said:

 

Exactly. A three-tiered system in which you have to sell $250 in order to reach (temporarily) the middle level but 100 times as much ($25K) to attain the third level sounds vaguely familiar. The top 1% (at most) get through the door, but everyone else is left shivering out in the cold.

 

A $10K threshold would be better, but I'd say that a $5K one would be the most realistic and productive one for both contributors and Alamy. It would provide both incentive and a steady supply exclusive images. As it is, Alamy is alienating contributors with the laughable $25K threshold and shooting itself in the foot at the same time. Not a great business plan...

 

 

but that's the problem.  They will come back, say they listened and move the last level to $5K or $10K (for now), and everyone is happy!....  in the end there is still no demonstration that they care about contributors anymore, they still haven't justified the other changes, including no stated distributors commission (wait until the make a deal with Walmart who keeps 70%),

 

 

 

[Mander Images]

If the changes "will not have a significant impact on Alamy’s financial performance" then why change the structure. The new commission may attract new business but the 20% rate will only serve to alienate the small man who helped you build your business. I suggest you scrap the silver level or risk losing some of your bread and butter contributors.

[meanderingemu]

42 minutes ago, Steve F said:

 

The five stages of grief - denial anger bargaining depression and acceptance...

 

 

 

i think we skipped denial

[Colblimp]

7 hours ago, Allan Bell said:

 

 

I will not be taking any drastic action at this time but will await Ms. Shelley's PROMISED reply in the two week time frame.

 

Then I will decide.

Don't hold your breath on that one... 😡🤥

[Martyn]

1 hour ago, geogphotos said:

Now, owned by PA it has a new CEO. Quite young, ambitious and keen to make a mark. 

 

 

 

 

A skid mark by the looks of things.

As has been already pointed out, this is Alamy in name only ... from a company that treated contributors like family to treating us with disdain and contempt. Since throwing away their unique selling point of providing clients with images that were not available anywhere else and being the go to place for clients looking for unique images, they have imported collections of images that can be found on many sites and have clearly concluded that individual contributors are a mere nuisance that they can well do without. 

[Joe Gaul]

I don't believe the myoptic bean counters at Alamy realize exactly what they have done by in one fell swoop destroying everything that made Alamy a unique place for image buyers. Instead of playing to their strengths of a rights manages exclusive collection to increase sales and sales value they are copying the micro model where SS and G hold all the aces. This may be an easy short-term option however I do not believe that Alamy can compete in that market. Sad times.

[meanderingemu]

1 minute ago, Joe Gaul said:

I don't believe the myoptic bean counters at Alamy realize exactly what they have done by in one fell swoop destroying everything that made Alamy a unique place for image buyers. Instead of playing to their strengths of a rights manages exclusive collection to increase sales and sales value they are copying the micro model where SS and G hold all the aces. This may be an easy short-term option however I do not believe that Alamy can compete in that market. Sad times.

 

 

i guess i am not as idealistic as some seem.  I totally believe they know exactly what they have done.

[Betty LaRue]

1 hour ago, Allan Bell said:

 

I note you and Betty think alike. I don't mind helping others who are or maybe in the same boat so long as it is nothing to do with the technicalities from here on in.

 

Allan

 

Allan, I simply no longer will put myself out there spending many many minutes looking at portfolios, advising newbies how to tag, caption, leave copyspace and all of that stuff. I’m spending my time doing something Alamy should do. I realize it’s hard for new people to absorb how/what to do, but from now on, that’s Alamy’s job, I’m not taking it on anymore. They desire to handle or maximize contributors, let ‘em have fun at it.

The usual forum conversations about the things I know regarding cameras, lenses and that kind of thing, I’m all in. Those are questions between each other and not in Alamy’s wheelhouse.

Mark, I think, was addressing our policing...telling people not to discuss St****mo in the forum, or not to discuss other agencies. That's really not our job, so why should we do it? I agree with him in that respect.

And yes, I’m angry.

I worked for a doctor in another lifetime. I was there 20 minutes early, cleaning and sterilizing rooms, not because I was told to, but because I wanted them clean for the patients. I often got short lunch hours because we were running late with patients. When everyone of the help walked out the door at 5pm, I was the one who was there late, sometimes 2 hours over, with a family I needed to put dinner on the table for. I was on salary, so I got no overtime. I just ate those hours.

I went to half days at one point after 5 years, because my knees swelled from arthritis so much I was limping by noon. My job kept me on my feet all day.
I went on hourly. I asked the doctor about benefits. Would I still get sick pay? Would I get paid vacation? It was ok if I didn’t, I was so grateful for part time, but I just wanted to know.

He put off answering (I need to ask my doctor friends what they do) for over a year, and I’d inquired multiple times. 
I became very ill with pneumonia and was hospitalized. The first time ever I’d missed work in 6 years. The business manager came to my room to ask my hours before cutting checks. I told her the doctor never told me if I got paid sick leave. She checked with him, he said no. That hurt me so incredibly because he, who I also considered a friend, chose the coward’s way to finally tell me that when I was most vulnerable.

I never felt the same loyalty to him again.

BTW, when the other women, my workmates, found out (one came to visit and caught me crying, pulled it out of me why) they ostracized and criticized him to his face so much that he reversed his edict and I got paid! He was in a hostile workplace!

Moral of this story is we, as a group, have been so very helpful to new people. Hours upon hours of help with the kind of advice that Alamy should be dishing out. When I’ve had a knife slipped between my 3rd and 4th ribs, I no longer feel so generous. The information is here. In Alamy’s pages, and in searching the forum threads. It’s not hard for newbies to find out what they need to know.

[Simon]

60% of nothing or 50% of something ?

 

As a direct result of the email yesterday, and no one getting in touch with me to confirm my rate despite my contacting them, I uploaded a handful of news / weather pics to other agencies today.  I've allready had one use on line in the Sun.  It seems fairly simple to me, Alamy can either have 60% of nothing, or 50% of something. Tomorrow I've got another great shooting opportunity which is going to go elsewhere.

[MDM]

29 minutes ago, Martyn said:

 

A skid mark by the looks of things.

As has been already pointed out, this is Alamy in name only ... from a company that treated contributors like family to treating us with disdain and contempt. Since throwing away their unique selling point of providing clients with images that were not available anywhere else and being the go to place for clients looking for unique images, they have imported collections of images that can be found on many sites and have clearly concluded that individual contributors are a mere nuisance that they can well do without. 

 

 

Looking at the blog post by Emily Shelley, it seems that they are more than aware of the importance of exclusivity for two reasons - one is selling (USP) and another is chasing infringements. Could it be that the latter (infringement chasing) is the main driver for this focus on exclusivity. I am guessing they would not be focusing on infringements unless they have calculated that it is  potentially lucrative.

 

But it makes no sense to alienate their most important asset - the individual contributors who can provide exclusive material that can be confidently chased up. And it makes no sense to give no incentive to contributors to provide exclusive images if exclusivity is one of their primary aims. That is more likely to lead to contributors removing exclusivity and even contributing elsewhere. It seems self-defeating to me. If they want to take a punitive approach, then cane those who were making false claims about exclusivity - stop their accounts or write something into the contract to fine them for breaches. It won't surprise me to see some reversal of this decision.

[Betty LaRue]

2 minutes ago, MDM said:

 

 

Looking at the blog post by Emily Shelley, it seems that they are more than aware of the importance of exclusivity for two reasons - one is selling (USP) and another is chasing infringements. Could it be that the latter (infringement chasing) is the main driver for this focus on exclusivity. I am guessing they would not be focusing on infringements unless they have calculated that it is  potentially lucrative.

 

But it makes no sense to alienate their most important asset - the individual contributors who can provide exclusive material that can be confidently chased up. And it makes no sense to give no incentive to contributors to provide exclusive images if exclusivity is one of their primary aims. That is more likely to lead to contributors removing exclusivity and even contributing elsewhere. It seems self-defeating to me. If they want to take a punitive approach, then cane those who were making false claims about exclusivity - stop their accounts or write something into the contract to fine them for breaches. It won't surprise me to see some reversal of this decision.

Very wise, Michael.

[mickfly]

5 hours ago, Sally said:

This is no problem if you use Alamy Lightroom Bridge, which I keep blaming on about but few people seem to use. It will download all captions and keywords automatically once you’ve matched the images in Lightroom to those on Alamy.

I've used it for years and happily fetch my data everytime I upload or make changes on the Alamy side, it also notifies me of sales before Alamy does, as I'm sure you already know.

[meanderingemu]

13 minutes ago, Betty LaRue said:

Allan, I simply no longer will put myself out there spending many many minutes looking at portfolios, advising newbies how to tag, caption, leave copyspace and all of that stuff. I’m spending my time doing something Alamy should do. I realize it’s hard for new people to absorb how/what to do, but from now on, that’s Alamy’s job, I’m not taking it on anymore. They desire to handle or maximize contributors, let ‘em have fun at it.

The usual forum conversations about the things I know regarding cameras, lenses and that kind of thing, I’m all in. Those are questions between each other and not in Alamy’s wheelhouse.

Mark, I think, was addressing our policing...telling people not to discuss St****mo in the forum, or not to discuss other agencies. That's really not our job, so why should we do it? I agree with him in that respect.

And yes, I’m angry.

 

 

totally understandable

 

i might still do it when i see it is clearly for the benefit of the contributor, and i see they are in a discussion, but as you i likely want do it for the drive by shooter where i was trying to do it for the image database to be a better place for customers. 

[Joe Gaul]

28 minutes ago, meanderingemu said:

 

 

i guess i am not as idealistic as some seem.  I totally believe they know exactly what they have done.

Not idealistic at all Emu. Also do not for one moment believe that the original Alamy was in any way altruistic - they milked it and passed it on. Just believe that this will not be a good business decision in the long run.

[Steve F]

30 minutes ago, MDM said:

If they want to take a punitive approach, then cane those who were making false claims about exclusivity - stop their accounts or write something into the contract to fine them for breaches. It won't surprise me to see some reversal of this decision.

 

Yes, why punish the majority for the minority

[Cryptoprocta]

2 minutes ago, Steve F said:

 

Yes, why punish the majority for the minority

Because it's an easy excuse to get more money from our work.

[Shergar]

49 minutes ago, Betty LaRue said:

Allan, I simply no longer will put myself out there spending many many minutes looking at portfolios, advising newbies how to tag, caption, leave copyspace and all of that stuff. I’m spending my time doing something Alamy should do. I realize it’s hard for new people to absorb how/what to do, but from now on, that’s Alamy’s job, I’m not taking it on anymore. They desire to handle or maximize contributors, let ‘em have fun at it.

The usual forum conversations about the things I know regarding cameras, lenses and that kind of thing, I’m all in. Those are questions between each other and not in Alamy’s wheelhouse.

Mark, I think, was addressing our policing...telling people not to discuss St****mo in the forum, or not to discuss other agencies. That's really not our job, so why should we do it? I agree with him in that respect.

And yes, I’m angry.

I worked for a doctor in another lifetime. I was there 20 minutes early, cleaning and sterilizing rooms, not because I was told to, but because I wanted them clean for the patients. I often got short lunch hours because we were running late with patients. When everyone of the help walked out the door at 5pm, I was the one who was there late, sometimes 2 hours over, with a family I needed to put dinner on the table for. I was on salary, so I got no overtime. I just ate those hours.

I went to half days at one point after 5 years, because my knees swelled from arthritis so much I was limping by noon. My job kept me on my feet all day.
I went on hourly. I asked the doctor about benefits. Would I still get sick pay? Would I get paid vacation? It was ok if I didn’t, I was so grateful for part time, but I just wanted to know.

He put off answering (I need to ask my doctor friends what they do) for over a year, and I’d inquired multiple times. 
I became very ill with pneumonia and was hospitalized. The first time ever I’d missed work in 6 years. The business manager came to my room to ask my hours before cutting checks. I told her the doctor never told me if I got paid sick leave. She checked with him, he said no. That hurt me so incredibly because he, who I also considered a friend, chose the coward’s way to finally tell me that when I was most vulnerable.

I never felt the same loyalty to him again.

BTW, when the other women, my workmates, found out (one came to visit and caught me crying, pulled it out of me why) they ostracized and criticized him to his face so much that he reversed his edict and I got paid! He was in a hostile workplace!

Moral of this story is we, as a group, have been so very helpful to new people. Hours upon hours of help with the kind of advice that Alamy should be dishing out. When I’ve had a knife slipped between my 3rd and 4th ribs, I no longer feel so generous. The information is here. In Alamy’s pages, and in searching the forum threads. It’s not hard for newbies to find out what they need to know.

Good for you Betty. We can't control the wind but we can adjust the sails.