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JaniMarkus Hasa

Category: Concepts

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I struggle with image categories every time. As most of my work is street photography, my solution is usually "travel" - they're always abroad for someone. :)

 

One category I haven't really used at all is "concepts". I really don't have a clue what sort of images would go under that category. Any opinions?

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FWIW I don't use them.

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Good question, I suppose that one way of addressing it is to look at the 'Concepts' category on the main Alamy category page under 'Browse images by category'. This brings up an extraordinary 12,338,442 images as of today and I believe that it is simply a slightly customised search for the word 'Concept' except with a selection of curated images added in the first few pages, that's my best guess anyway. A straight search for 'Concept' brings up 12,638, 694 images.

 

If we (or the public) could search just on the optional category fields we would be able to get some feedback about how it is currently used but obviously that's not possible.

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I've recent;y started adding category information to images in one of my older pseudonyms. It's very early days and I have only done the work on a modest  proportion of the images in that pseudonym, but I can't report any noticeable change in the number of views, zooms (and certainly not  sales) - and I monitor the trends on these metrics carefully. On what I have seen so far I wouldn't be suggesting to anybody that they worry overmuch about categories.

 

To take up your original question,I shoot in a similar style to yourself and have never had the occasion to use the word 'concept' in keywords or caption. If I specifically shot an image which was primarily looking to illustrate an abstract concept (e.g. happiness, peace) then I might be persuaded to use the Concept category. For me though, it is outside my normal realm of work. 

Edited by Joseph Clemson
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7 hours ago, spacecadet said:

FWIW I don't use them.

 

Given that the categories we have to choose between in Alamy Image Manger don't match those on the Alamy search page, they do seem to be more trouble than they are worth. I might give up using them too.

 

Mark

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Ok, yesterday I invented a new country and chose two of my images at random. In one I put it in as a keyword and in the other I put it in the Location field.Today, after the server update only the image with this new country in the keywords comes up in the search. This suggests to me that anything entered in the Location field is not searchable, apart from USA, UK, Europe & Australia as mentioned above.

 

I've corrected the images in AIM but for one day only we have Ozstralia.

 

Edit:

Well I've only gone and put this in the wrong thread.

Edited by Harry Harrison
Wrong thread
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One of the things James mentioned at our very informal and amiable lunch meeting in Ely the other day  is that Alamy is intending to categorise the entire collection of images according to the existing categories and will be using some form of AI to do so. He did suggest that this will be happening over the next unspecified while - in other words it is a real intention. He didn't  specify how this will be done (tags, examination of image content itself or a combo of both) but it is probably worth doing them yourselves as you go along rather than having them done by machine. I am not clear exactly how these will be used. I used to fill them in although recently I have not bothered so much and will not be going back through my collection to do so but will start to do them again as I go. The biggest problem with them is that they are often too vague and broad I think

 

 

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1 hour ago, MDM said:

Alamy is intending to categorise the entire collection of images according to the existing categories and will be using some form of AI to do so

Thanks, yes that is interesting but alarming also. AI  Yikes!

 

If AI can be trusted to do it then I hope they rethink the existing categories at the same time and take on board some of the suggestions offered, or all of them even. Perhaps even ask the community for more suggestions with this in mind.

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1 hour ago, Harry Harrison said:

Thanks, yes that is interesting but alarming also. AI  Yikes!

 

If AI can be trusted to do it then I hope they rethink the existing categories at the same time and take on board some of the suggestions offered, or all of them even. Perhaps even ask the community for more suggestions with this in mind.

 

I have to jump in here to clarify before a thread goes down a certain path :)

 

- Our desire / target is to have all images categorised

- We feel image categorising is important and encourage you to do so on all images

- We are exploring the best ways to go about this, and there are many ways, including looking at AI methods

 

Cheers

 

James A

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9 minutes ago, Alamy said:

 

I have to jump in here to clarify before a thread goes down a certain path :)

 

- Our desire / target is to have all images categorised

- We feel image categorising is important and encourage you to do so on all images

- We are exploring the best ways to go about this, and there are many ways, including looking at AI methods

 

Cheers

 

James A

 

That's great... but having achieved your target and got most images categorised, then what? What purpose/benefit/advantage does it bring?

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1 hour ago, Alamy said:

I have to jump in here to clarify before a thread goes down a certain path :)

 

- Our desire / target is to have all images categorised

- We feel image categorising is important and encourage you to do so on all images

- We are exploring the best ways to go about this, and there are many ways, including looking at AI methods

Thank you for jumping in but do please consider the suggestions for new revised categories that have been made, many of us find the existing list falls short of our requirements. It would also be helpful if you created a page to give your recommendations as to how to best apply these primary and secondary categories. For example, as has been stated above, everywhere is 'Travel' to someone. It would be great if they corresponded with your own 'Browse by category' options also.

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1 hour ago, Alamy said:

 

I have to jump in here to clarify before a thread goes down a certain path :)

 

- Our desire / target is to have all images categorised

- We feel image categorising is important and encourage you to do so on all images

- We are exploring the best ways to go about this, and there are many ways, including looking at AI methods

 

Cheers

 

James A

 

I really don't understand why categories are so important. As a means of narrowing down a search they seem to be a very blunt tool compared with well-keyworded and captioned images. What do categories bring to the table which makes it worthwhile for either contributor or Alamy to spend time and money introducing them?

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1 hour ago, Alamy said:

 

I have to jump in here to clarify before a thread goes down a certain path :)

 

- Our desire / target is to have all images categorised

- We feel image categorising is important and encourage you to do so on all images

- We are exploring the best ways to go about this, and there are many ways, including looking at AI methods

 

Cheers

 

James A

 

The majority of what I shoot is reportage news based, and there is a considerable amount of lapsed live news images in my port. It's therefore easy to categorise these as News and Reportage, and I currently do so. I still have to do this to my older submissions. When I diversify and shoot traditional stock, including signage and company HQ buildings, store fronts of companies who are or maybe of media interest, so far I haven't entered any category. Should these be Architecture and Interiors? I can understand contributors concern when images don't appear to match any of the current categories, and although I maybe jumping the gun here, there is concern AI category allocations may in fact make it harder for clients to find our images. Is it likely that the new categories will carry more weight in client searches than current captions and tags? 

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I’m a good girl (😊), I choose a category as best I can for every image. Usually only one though, since many times it’s so hard to figure one out. Why? Things that have happened in the past make me not want to go back and add something to thousands of images when I can do it at the outset.

I figure if the categories end up not used, I have really lost nothing by having them, but if they are ultimately used, then I’m ahead of the game.

I definitely think there is a need for expansion of the field, but on the other hand, there would be more scrolling to look through them, resulting in more time spent doing so.

One way is to add new ones is as a sub-category. So you have a storefront of a fast-food place. I choose “business”, although that business is in the food industry. So do I choose “food” as secondary? There is no food showing in the image.

It seems more correct to have “business” as the main, and when you click on it, you’ll see a drop-down with food, fashion, manufacturing etc as subs. It seems this would define “food” as not necessarily having food in the image, but defining what kind of business.

Of course, a picture of a hamburger would be under the original categories “food”, and really not necessary to have a sub category attached to it, because that list would be too extensive.

Am I overthinking?

Betty

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7 minutes ago, Betty LaRue said:

Am I overthinking?

That makes sense Betty but without any guidance from 'above' it's very difficult to know. I too would think that shopfronts and signs were probably business but who knows, we're all doing it blind. A lot of pictures of the English countryside could be Landscape, but with animals or crops they might also be Agriculture, but surely not industry as in 'Industry and Agriculture'.

 

I propose a new Alamy meet up parlour game "Guess the category". I suspect that out of 10 people there will be 5 different opinions for each image.

Edited by Harry Harrison

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25 minutes ago, Harry Harrison said:

That makes sense Betty but without any guidance from 'above' it's very difficult to know. I too would think that shopfronts and signs were probably business but who knows, we're all doing it blind. A lot of pictures of the English countryside could be Landscape, but with animals or crops they might also be Agriculture, but surely not industry as in 'Industry and Agriculture'.

 

I propose a new Alamy meet up parlour game "Guess the category". I suspect that out of 10 people there will be 5 different opinions for each image.

 

That might make a fun thread in the 'Pictures' category.

 

Edited by Matt Ashmore
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1 minute ago, Matt Ashmore said:

That might make a fin thread in the 'Pictures' category.

Not sure Alamy would think it was fun, but it actually would be interesting to discuss how people apply them. But, and it's a big 'but', there will be no right answer so in the end it might feel a little futile.

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I have imagined that "Business" would be men in suits, Wall St. sign or financial district buildings. I'm not a native speaker so some nuances may get lost in translation.

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10 minutes ago, JaniMarkus Hasa said:

I have imagined that "Business" would be men in suits, Wall St. sign or financial district buildings. I'm not a native speaker so some nuances may get lost in translation.

I think that is just as valid, helps to show how there can be several different interpretations. I've suggested a 'Retail' category which might be the natural home for shop signs, shopping, high streets, supermarket shelves etc.

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3 hours ago, JaniMarkus Hasa said:

I have imagined that "Business" would be men in suits, Wall St. sign or financial district buildings. I'm not a native speaker so some nuances may get lost in translation.

 

hence the issue with anything about categories....  

 

i have a street entertainer dressed in a Panda suit at a major touristy spot in London:  Travel, Occupation, Lifestyle, Animal, Entertainment are all viable options...  

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On 17/01/2020 at 07:42, Alamy said:

 

I have to jump in here to clarify before a thread goes down a certain path :)

 

- Our desire / target is to have all images categorised

- We feel image categorising is important and encourage you to do so on all images

- We are exploring the best ways to go about this, and there are many ways, including looking at AI methods

 

Cheers

 

James A

 

 

One question on categories, is the category "News and reportage" specifically for images that were uploaded under these upload Options?  If yes, what should images that are more of that sort but uploaded as regular stock be marked as?

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Hopefully, Alamy will add some more categories before categorizing their entire collection. As discussed numerous times on this forum, the current list of categories is inadequate. For instance, not having a category for environmental concerns these days is a big mistake. There have been many other good suggestions made by forum members.

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I use the concepts category a fair amount -- for any image that might be used to illustrate a concept, which isn't surprising I guess.

 

I also put signs, pictograms, and other symbols in concepts.

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On 17/01/2020 at 14:42, Alamy said:

 

I have to jump in here to clarify before a thread goes down a certain path :)

 

- Our desire / target is to have all images categorised

- We feel image categorising is important and encourage you to do so on all images

- We are exploring the best ways to go about this, and there are many ways, including looking at AI methods

 

Cheers

 

James A

 

I have never understood why the categories and the absolutely necessary ticking of people/property and whether releases have been obtained or not should be found under the tab "Optional", when it definitely is not optional. Wouldn't "Additional" or nearly any other text remove most misunderstandings?

 

Cheers,

 

Niels Quist

Edited by Niels Quist
adding the question mark
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