Martin P Wilson Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 On balance I think if you're 'invested' in Alamy as a contributor this a good thing in that shows Alamy are on top of what is going on in the marketplace. Plenty of other agencies in various price brackets already have mobile phone collections that are performing well? The trend and demand for the realistic immediacy of phone images (or shots with that feel) is the thing at the moment and it's no use putting claims of x squillion images on your homepage if few are of the style buyers are looking for. Keeping buyers coming by keeping the collection relevant is good for all of us. Having said that my mobile shots will go elsewhere while it's IOS only, never mind iPhone or android, what about Nokia windows phone for the best mobile cameras?! Alex I disagree; it may be good for Alamy but it is not good for individual contributors. The pursuit of image numbers is constantly diluting any individual's contribution and reducing the chance of a sale. Combined with a "pile it high sell" it cheap so individual sales go down works for Alamy but not contributors. With a lower average quality fewer high end customers will bother searching, further driving down average fee value. As others have said, it is a race to the bottom in which the contributor is the biggest loser. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexH Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 I take your point Martin, and I agree a pursuit of pure numbers is not productive for Alamy or contributors. But as I said this doesn't just adds 000 onto the total but a different type, quality and feel of image which is currently very much in vogue and which to date Alamy wasn't really offering. It's about evolution, not just getting bigger for the sake of size. Alex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duncan_Andison Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 these arguments have raged for years at Alamy. have you taken a long stroll through the backwoods that are the deeper pages of Alamy? Blimey there is a lot of absolute rubbish. It's not like the arrival of stockimo is going to make much difference. The good images/photographers will rise to the top and the crap will go to the bottom ( I know that's a generalisation because some good pics do get lost in the dross but that's been the case for many years)... Alamy is a numbers game in reality, and if you want a better, more bespoke agency for your pics, go to Corbis or Getty. I have to admit that I only send Alamy the stuff that my other agencies don't want! With 20 million images it's a bit late to start discussing whether the customer may get irritated if there are too many irrelevant images! Rather than worrying about Stockimo, I think we'd be better off getting rid of the idiots that send in 30 versions of the same picture... True, but they weren't ever pushed to the first page as the phone images currently are. Nothing is pushed to the front page. Search results follow exactly the same rules as any other images. So why are so many people reporting finding them at the front of searches? Keyword relevancy, diversity algorithm etc etc. But they don't have keywords? Just a title that is used instead?!? Edit.... Misunderstanding, they do use keywords and title. But, question around a brand new Psuedo appearing at the top is still questionable. To be honest, can't be bothered arguing the T*ss about this. It's your party after all. It's down to us to decide whether we want to turn up I guess. This I will do but only after I've been round a couple of other parties first.... I maybe a little drunk and not quit as quick witted by the time I get here but what the hell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jill Morgan Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 On balance I think if you're 'invested' in Alamy as a contributor this a good thing in that shows Alamy are on top of what is going on in the marketplace. Plenty of other agencies in various price brackets already have mobile phone collections that are performing well? The trend and demand for the realistic immediacy of phone images (or shots with that feel) is the thing at the moment and it's no use putting claims of x squillion images on your homepage if few are of the style buyers are looking for. Keeping buyers coming by keeping the collection relevant is good for all of us. Having said that my mobile shots will go elsewhere while it's IOS only, never mind iPhone or android, what about Nokia windows phone for the best mobile cameras?! Alex I disagree; it may be good for Alamy but it is not good for individual contributors. The pursuit of image numbers is constantly diluting any individual's contribution and reducing the chance of a sale. Combined with a "pile it high sell" it cheap so individual sales go down works for Alamy but not contributors. With a lower average quality and fewer high end customers will bother searching, further driving down average fee value. As others have said, it is a race to the bottom in which the contributor is the biggest loser. Martin has it right. It isn't accepting phone images, its accepting obviously low quality images. Personally, I don't care what equipment someone used to take their photo, if it can pass QC, then fine. And having different standards for different users makes no sense to me at all. I don't even understand having an acceptable camera list. Why can't a photo simply be judged on its own, no matter what equipment was used. A good photo is a good photo. Jill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Mitchell Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 I wonder if they will have a sin bin for iPhone photographers? Yes, it will be unofficially called the iBin (as in "iBin there"). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Mitchell Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Being just a dumb guy with a dumb phone, I'm really confused. It sounds as if iPhone images are being integrated into the general collection. Will there at least be a clickable "Stockimo" (or whatever) tab at the top of the search results pages so that potential buyers can separate phone shots from existing stock? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duncan_Andison Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Being just a dumb guy with a dumb phone, I'm really confused. It sounds as if iPhone images are being integrated into the general collection. Will there at least be a clickable "Stockimo" (or whatever) tab at the top of the search results pages so that potential buyers can separate phone shots from existing stock? No.... this is one of my main complaints. The customer has to see them all and if you try to use image size to get rid of them, you will find there are plenty of iPhone shots with resolutions greater than the resolution of the iPhone camera.... very clever stuff! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WelshDesigns Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 I uploaded a photo, but where does it go? I don't see it in my normal list of Alamy images, and I can't see any reference to it here on the normal Alamy site. Also I don't see anything in the Stockimo app about pending approval, or any feedback about that image, or how to ever see it again. How do you manage such images once it's uploaded? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Mitchell Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Being just a dumb guy with a dumb phone, I'm really confused. It sounds as if iPhone images are being integrated into the general collection. Will there at least be a clickable "Stockimo" (or whatever) tab at the top of the search results pages so that potential buyers can separate phone shots from existing stock? No.... this is one of my main complaints. The customer has to see them all and if you try to use image size to get rid of them, you will find there are plenty of iPhone shots with resolutions greater than the resolution of the iPhone camera.... very clever stuff! Hmmm... Maybe iDumb but this doesn't sound like a good idea. I can understand (sort of) Alamy's embracing the inevitable, but I think that they should rethink mixing phone shots with regular stock images. This will just hasten the proverbial "race to the bottom" as others have pointed out. Better to separate the iPhone images and woo a different type of buyer IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jill Morgan Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Being just a dumb guy with a dumb phone, I'm really confused. It sounds as if iPhone images are being integrated into the general collection. Will there at least be a clickable "Stockimo" (or whatever) tab at the top of the search results pages so that potential buyers can separate phone shots from existing stock? No.... this is one of my main complaints. The customer has to see them all and if you try to use image size to get rid of them, you will find there are plenty of iPhone shots with resolutions greater than the resolution of the iPhone camera.... very clever stuff! Surely this must have occurred to Alamy that all people had t do was move other photos on to their iPhone and upload them that way. Great way to bypass QC. But you would think that the ones that are doing this would at least change the image size to that of an iPhone. Jill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duncan_Andison Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Being just a dumb guy with a dumb phone, I'm really confused. It sounds as if iPhone images are being integrated into the general collection. Will there at least be a clickable "Stockimo" (or whatever) tab at the top of the search results pages so that potential buyers can separate phone shots from existing stock? No.... this is one of my main complaints. The customer has to see them all and if you try to use image size to get rid of them, you will find there are plenty of iPhone shots with resolutions greater than the resolution of the iPhone camera.... very clever stuff! Surely this must have occurred to Alamy that all people had t do was move other photos on to their iPhone and upload them that way. Great way to bypass QC. But you would think that the ones that are doing this would at least change the image size to that of an iPhone. Jill It's not quite that simple, you would have to amend the EXIF data, but that is easily done. I mean, if you have a new camera that isn't supported by your favourite Raw converter, you can amend the camera details in the EXIF so you can load it into the programme. Takes a couple of seconds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin P Wilson Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 I take your point Martin, and I agree a pursuit of pure numbers is not productive for Alamy or contributors. But as I said this doesn't just adds 000 onto the total but a different type, quality and feel of image which is currently very much in vogue and which to date Alamy wasn't really offering. It's about evolution, not just getting bigger for the sake of size. Alex I don't have a problem, as other have said, with phone images as such. I have a problem with the dual standards in the same collection. I have long had a problem with Alamy's pursuit, and crowing, about the number of images without editing. It creates a low end environment which inevitably drives down prices and dilutes the offering so that many good images are lost amongst the dross, I do not make any great claims about my own work or bleat about my sales - I just take a view about where I will apply my effort. Its Alamy's party and I recognise their commercial imperative FOR ALAMY of going this route but as Duncan says it is up to each of us whether we want to bring a bottle. As Duncan is doing I need to visit more parties, at least one I have tried was not encouraging, the choice of music was good but the organisation and sound system was awful!Made a bit more money but admin ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linda Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 I'm not a power cell phone user. My cell phone contract expired in July and I got on the 'Pay as you go' plan for my iPhone 4 and it saves me appx $50 a month from the regular contracted plan. Not getting an iPhone 5 or better until I lose or break my phone. I don't think this APP will work on the older iPhones. L Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Mitchell Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 "I don't have a problem, as other have said, with phone images as such. I have a problem with the dual standards in the same collection" Exactly. The greybeards have spoken! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin P Wilson Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Oh, that'll soon sort itself out. After customers return numerous pictures because they are out of focus and / or full of noise, Alamy will quickly place them apart. Cheers, Philippe Indeed it will and reputation will take a dive ... Lost customers or lower prices all round anybody? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linda Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 I really hope they create separate collection or a new site all together. This will be a mess for a client to weed thru. Additionally with all of these effects with cell phone apps will they look at 'real photos' differently? L Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Brook Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 "In 1932, he bought a Leica camera in Marseilles and it was from this moment that he felt he really became a photographer. The Leica liberated the art from heavy and cumbersome technology, enabling Cartier-Bresson to travel and take pictures. It was the age of the snapshot." (An article about HCB - my italics) In 1932 the Leica was regarded with a similar degree of contempt by 'professional' togs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Mitchell Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 I really hope they create separate collection of a new site all together. This will be a mess for a client to weed thru. Additionally with all of these effects with cell phone apps will they look at 'real photos' differently? L A new site altogether. Now that is a brilliant idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Mitchell Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 "In 1932, he bought a Leica camera in Marseilles and it was from this moment that he felt he really became a photographer. The Leica liberated the art from heavy and cumbersome technology, enabling Cartier-Bresson to travel and take pictures. It was the age of the snapshot." (An article about HCB - my italics) In 1932 the Leica was regarded with a similar degree of contempt by 'professional' togs. Good analogy. But a cellphone isn't a Leica, not yet anyway. No doubt the time will come. In the meantime, until the technology is there, I don't think it's wise to mix iPhone pics with regular stock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Chapman Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Good idea to add mobile imagery, but it may need a more easy/obvious way for the user to segregate results according to quality. If a mobile image passes the same QC requirements as the main collection, no problem. But if mobile imagery isn't subject to the same QC requirements and is added to the same collection, it makes a complete nonsense of the acceptable camera list and existing QC. One of Alamy's selling points (presumably) is that the majority of the images that appear in the search results are of high technical quality, so the buyer needn't worry too much about this and can download images safe in the knowledge that when they see the image at 100% they won't be disappointed from a technical viewpoint. If lower quality mobile imagery appears in the same search results as the images which had to pass existing QC, without a clear way to distinguish them (selecting the MP level just doesn't do this) it will quickly devalue the existing collection. A collection which your valued contributors have carefully prepared in line with your stringent QC requirements. Alamy, PLEASE consider adding another tab on the search results page e.g. Add "Mobile" to the "New", "Creative", "Relevant", tabs. Or add or some other button to allow this. I don't think the idea that the the user will spot that the image ref starts with an S or will set the megapixel limit will work. Alternatively put a red frame, or something obvious, around the thumbnails of images that are lower res or haven't been through QC, with a suitable "popup" when the mouse is hovered over the thumbnail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abiyoyo Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 What about geotag, if enabled of an image taken with an iPhone. Will it be available to the customers as part of the metadata? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gervais Montacute Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 I don't think buyers care about actual quality as much as they do about content. I've seen all this before within stock sites of a different nature. This is doom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 I only have a bog standard old Nokia - never used it to take a photo. I wont be rushing out to buy an iPhone either.... Kumar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duncan_Andison Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Good idea to add mobile imagery, but it may need a more easy/obvious way for the user to segregate results according to quality. If a mobile image passes the same QC requirements as the main collection, no problem. But if mobile imagery isn't subject to the same QC requirements and is added to the same collection, it makes a complete nonsense of the acceptable camera list and existing QC. One of Alamy's selling points (presumably) is that the majority of the images that appear in the search results are of high technical quality, so the buyer needn't worry too much about this and can download images safe in the knowledge that when they see the image at 100% they won't be disappointed from a technical viewpoint. If lower quality mobile imagery appears in the same search results as the images which had to pass exiting QC, without a clear way to distinguish them (selecting the MP level just doesn't do this) it will quickly devalue the existing collection. A collection which your valued contributors have carefully prepared in line with your stringent QC requirements. Alamy, PLEASE consider adding another tab on the search results page e.g. Add "Mobile" to the "New", "Creative", "Relevant", tabs. Or add or some other button to allow this. I don't think the idea that the the user will spot that the image ref starts with an S or will set the megapixel limit will work. Alternatively put a red frame, or something obvious, around the thumbnails of images that are lower res or haven't been through QC, with a suitable "popup" when the mouse is hovered over the thumbnail. +1 Bang on. Good idea, poorly implemented. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig Yates Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 I think the S prefix will be followed by using H,I and T. and E for good measure. Regards Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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