Submission failed all photos rejected - which photo was the problem?

[markus]

I contribute at a few stock platforms and Alamy is the only one that does QC on a submission/batch level instead on an individual level.

So I upload 15 photos, my submission failed, and I have no idea at all why and no idea which photo was the reason for it. 

 

How should I learn about that so that I can correct the single photo or leave it out. Now all other photos got rejected as well.

From my point of view a very strange approach to do the quality control.

 

One or more images failed QC. This means the remaining images have been rejected without being assessed.

 

I really do not know how to deal with that.

 

[markus]

Can I delete my own post in the forum? Obviously not. 

I could identify the problematic photo - I did not see that at the first look. So at least now I can identify the photo and can work on a correction.

 

However, it turns out that several submissions got rejected because of one photo.

 

So I uploaded different batches on different days (within 5 days)

1 photo 

14 photos

15 photos -> here was a problem with QC of a photo

1 photo

5 photos

 

All of the submissions got rejected.

Edited January 2, 2020 by markus

[meanderingemu]

7 minutes ago, markus said:

Can I delete my own post in the forum? Obviously not. 

I could identify the problematic photo - I did not see that at the first look. So at least now I can identify the photo and can work on a correction.

 

However, it turns out that several submissions got rejected because of one photo.

 

So I uploaded different batches on different days (within 5 days)

1 photo 

14 photos

15 photos -> here was a problem with QC of a photo

1 photo

5 photos

 

All of the submissions got rejected.

 

 

from Alamy standpoint, all your photo's in QC when they review are one submission, and fact that at least one they looked at had an issue, they want you to review all your process.  

 

this may be harsh if the error was an uploading error, not an image processing one.  

[Harry Harrison]

8 minutes ago, markus said:

Can I delete my own post in the forum? Obviously not. 

You can delete the contents but not the post, at least that's my understanding. Obviously you can edit the post in the light of further information which is probably the best route, especially if you make it obvious what you've done.

 

I had QC fails in the beginning, it happens and we learn from it! Alamy will give you the reason for the fail on that image but they won't go on to check any more and all in the pipeline will fail, I guess that is what has happened here.

[John Richmond]

Alamy operate a batch QC process for suppliers that is common in industry and retail.  We as suppliers (contributors) are expected to do our own QC to Alamy standards.  Alamy then sample the upload(s) in the QC queue and, should the sample contain a substandard image, reject the whole batch.  The contributor's own QC has failed. 

 

Alamy do provide a failure reason - but only for that one image that triggered the QC fail.  Resubmitting without checking all the other images for that particular problem (and any others that can trigger a fail) is a good way to fail again.  And that can further consequences including temporary withdrawal of upload privileges. 

[Niels Quist]

It's all in the terms that any newish submitter should read:

https://www.alamy.com/contributor/how-to-sell-images/alamy-quality-control/?section=5

 

[meanderingemu]

3 hours ago, Niels Quist said:

It's all in the terms that any newish submitter should read:

https://www.alamy.com/contributor/how-to-sell-images/alamy-quality-control/?section=5

 

 

 

based on reading a few rejections query i think one of the issue with this for many newcomers is the use of the term "submission"   (see OP's comment in second post "However, it turns out that several submissions got rejected because of one photo.")

 

Quote

• We’ll just spot-check a few of your images per submission 
• If the images we check are ok, your whole submission will pass 
• If we find a problem with one image, your whole submission will fail 

 

 

QC seems to define "submission"  as all the image outstanding for review, however AIM splits all "submissions" into every time one presses submit, and this is what the contributor sees.  What QC does is correct, as it removes the potential for abuse of just pressing submit after each images,  but i can see why there would be some confusion.    

[Harry Harrison]

8 minutes ago, meanderingemu said:

i can see why there would be some confusion.

 

Yes, they should clarify that, I was confused to begin with though never got caught out by it as I tend to do a largish batch at a time, my assumption was though that it was that the whole batch would be rejected, but not all batches waiting for QC.  Of course no mention of the mysteriously unannounced 5 stars on their official page either.

[markus]

On 03/01/2020 at 00:22, Harry Harrison said:

You can delete the contents but not the post, at least that's my understanding. Obviously you can edit the post in the light of further information which is probably the best route, especially if you make it obvious what you've done.

 

I had QC fails in the beginning, it happens and we learn from it! Alamy will give you the reason for the fail on that image but they won't go on to check any more and all in the pipeline will fail, I guess that is what has happened here.

 

Yes, you are absolutely right. I do understand now. Better make smaller bathes for the beginning to learn. Thanks!

[markus]

On 03/01/2020 at 04:59, John Richmond said:

Alamy operate a batch QC process for suppliers that is common in industry and retail.  We as suppliers (contributors) are expected to do our own QC to Alamy standards.  Alamy then sample the upload(s) in the QC queue and, should the sample contain a substandard image, reject the whole batch.  The contributor's own QC has failed. 

 

Alamy do provide a failure reason - but only for that one image that triggered the QC fail.  Resubmitting without checking all the other images for that particular problem (and any others that can trigger a fail) is a good way to fail again.  And that can further consequences including temporary withdrawal of upload privileges. 

 

Thanks for your feedback. I initially did not see the failure reason, and not even the one photography that triggered the rejection, thus I was felt left alone here. But it was my mistake and I saw the declined image in the batch later on including reason. Understood now how the process works. Thx.

[markus]

On 03/01/2020 at 20:34, meanderingemu said:

based on reading a few rejections query i think one of the issue with this for many newcomers is the use of the term "submission"   (see OP's comment in second post "However, it turns out that several submissions got rejected because of one photo.")

QC seems to define "submission"  as all the image outstanding for review, however AIM splits all "submissions" into every time one presses submit, and this is what the contributor sees.  What QC does is correct, as it removes the potential for abuse of just pressing submit after each images,  but i can see why there would be some confusion.    

 

Exactly, that was the final part that was leading to confusion. I did not understand what they see as "submission". I set up my process that way that I handle the actual uploading to 5 different stock platforms via Xpiks (an application for keywording and uploading simultaneously to several platforms). I expected every uploaded batch, i.e., collection of stock photos, to be seen as an individual submission from QC.

 

So from my point of view I contributed 5 submissions within a few days. From the QC point of view this was obviously seen as 1 single submission.

 

My learning:

• Better QC by myself before even uploading
• Smaller batches
• More time between uploading batches, so that they are handled by QC as separate submissions

 

[meanderingemu]

2 hours ago, markus said:

 

Exactly, that was the final part that was leading to confusion. I did not understand what they see as "submission". I set up my process that way that I handle the actual uploading to 5 different stock platforms via Xpiks (an application for keywording and uploading simultaneously to several platforms). I expected every uploaded batch, i.e., collection of stock photos, to be seen as an individual submission from QC.

 

So from my point of view I contributed 5 submissions within a few days. From the QC point of view this was obviously seen as 1 single submission.

 

My learning:

• Better QC by myself before even uploading
• Smaller batches
• More time between uploading batches, so that they are handled by QC as separate submissions

 

 

 

in fairness, the Congratulations you have passed QC e-mail always referred to submission singular, even if all the images  had not been submitted together.

 

 

as for your learnings, the first one is the only one that really counts.  If you do that, you will pass QC regardless of number of images.   

[markus]

10 minutes ago, meanderingemu said:

as for your learnings, the first one is the only one that really counts.  If you do that, you will pass QC regardless of number of images.   

 

That is for sure true - however, everything got its learning curve. After some time the chances of rejection will decrease as I simply know better by then. For the start it is most likely recommended to go for smaller submissions. Thanks for all your feedback and help!

[meanderingemu]

11 hours ago, markus said:

 

That is for sure true - however, everything got its learning curve. After some time the chances of rejection will decrease as I simply know better by then. For the start it is most likely recommended to go for smaller submissions. Thanks for all your feedback and help!

 

 

but that's a double sword if the own QC is not done properly.  Since QC looks at a few images per "QC defined submission" you then have more images reviewed by going the small upload at a time.  

 

based on your other comments that you upload elsewhere, one thing i did as i was learning when i started, for images that i thought could be borderline, was to use MS sites as an additional QC in my process.  

[markus]

4 hours ago, meanderingemu said:

but that's a double sword if the own QC is not done properly.  Since QC looks at a few images per "QC defined submission" you then have more images reviewed by going the small upload at a time.  

 

based on your other comments that you upload elsewhere, one thing i did as i was learning when i started, for images that i thought could be borderline, was to use MS sites as an additional QC in my process.  

 

That is true, in absolute numbers probably more photos are checked.

 

Is it unusual that I started uploading on several stock photo platforms? I thought it makes more sense instead of focusing only on one. Editing, keywording, describing is anyway already done.

 

What is MS sites? Sharepoint? If so, I can unfortunately not follow how you do an additional QC before the actual Alamy QC.

 

 

[meanderingemu]

1 hour ago, markus said:

 

That is true, in absolute numbers probably more photos are checked.

 

Is it unusual that I started uploading on several stock photo platforms? I thought it makes more sense instead of focusing only on one. Editing, keywording, describing is anyway already done.

 

What is MS sites? Sharepoint? If so, I can unfortunately not follow how you do an additional QC before the actual Alamy QC.

 

 

 

 

MS is Microstock, like i've seen you submit to.  If you insist on using them and are not sure of your own QC, might as well use their feature of no impact of rejections by submitting to them first, and use that as an additional QC

[Colin Woods]

On 07/01/2020 at 19:14, markus said:

My learning:

• Better QC by myself before even uploading
• Smaller batches
• More time between uploading batches, so that they are handled by QC as separate submissions

 

When you get number 1 right, then 2 and 3 become irrelevant.

[meanderingemu]

11 hours ago, Colin Woods said:

 

When you get number 1 right, then 2 and 3 become irrelevant.

 🙂  as you can see from replies when i pointed it out, that's too complicated.  Easier to let Alamy do it, like all the great MS

 

 

[Colin Woods]

3 hours ago, meanderingemu said:

as you can see from replies when i pointed it out, that's too complicated.  Easier to let Alamy do it,

We are suppliers of a product to a company and we are required to meet their specifications. If a photographer thinks its too complicated they are in the wrong business. Alamy's requirements are pretty basic and straightforward. Submit focused, exposed and sharp images that are free of aberrations/blemishes. It absolutely is not their job to inspect the quality of our work.

[markus]

It seems I make the impression I am lazy. I am not. I only tried to better and faster understand, to estimate in what direction I should/could look at, and understand what can be an efficient workflow for me. I am not a pro in photography, and not a pro in stock or microstock photography. I like my photography development in the last year, and might push it forward. 

 

Some questions I have might upset some (as in 'why don't you just Google it ffs'), as they are just "so beginner". Well, sorry, it is how it is. In all fairness. Not everyone can start as a pro.

 

Thanks again for help, feedback, opinions. I got it.

 

 

 

 

[meanderingemu]

18 hours ago, Colin Woods said:

We are suppliers of a product to a company and we are required to meet their specifications. If a photographer thinks its too complicated they are in the wrong business. Alamy's requirements are pretty basic and straightforward. Submit focused, exposed and sharp images that are free of aberrations/blemishes. It absolutely is not their job to inspect the quality of our work.

 

 

maybe another one of these "stranger in a strange land" issue, where we don't expect people to do the work for us, and other generations do.  

the one thing i don't understand is why no one understand that deferring the work to someone else has a cost.  There is a reason MS will keep up 85% of the fee to cover their side...  

[meanderingemu]

14 hours ago, markus said:

 

 

Some questions I have might upset some (as in 'why don't you just Google it ffs'), as they are just "so beginner". Well, sorry, it is how it is. In all fairness. Not everyone can start as a pro.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

i don't think anyone would expect to use Google, when this forum actually has all the information required.  When i started i probably spent 2 weeks just going through pages and pages on posts, from what people sold, to optimal keywording and divergent views on many subjects.  In addition Alamy is the only agency i've seen that provides tools like All of Alamy, and give us insight on what their customers are looking for... 

[Cryptoprocta]

On 10/01/2020 at 14:08, meanderingemu said:

  In addition Alamy is the only agency i've seen that provides tools like All of Alamy, and give us insight on what their customers are looking for... 

Hmmm, at least one main rival provides submission briefs, but not usually for the sort of editorial work which is requested here, mostly fully released shoots. And at least one other main rival provides information about searches, which apparently people there find useful.

[Betty LaRue]

Markus, there is a wealth of information on this forum. Just start looking at all the threads, but don’t stop at the page that’s showing. There are many more pages seen by numbers at the bottom. 
Then you can do searches. I was horrible at that in the beginning, but I am getting a bit better. What I’m saying is that as bad at it as I am, I’m still trying. That’s the only way I can get better at it.  You just use keywords in the search, or a phrase. It is slow and laborious sometimes, but becoming a successful stock shooter isn’t for sissies. You have to put in the work, and make great attempts at finding answers before you expect us to hand them out. We know the difference, we’re kind of a wise bunch around here with noses to sniff out all sorts of things.

I just uploaded photos this evening. One of them is a closeup of a shrub with berries taken outdoors by a shopping mall. At first I thought, by the color of the leaves, that it was Abelia. I took pictures of it in spring with flowers and butterflies years ago. But I researched for an hour and a half googling, looking in nursery stock, chacking Wikipedia and the stock here on Alamy until I had a roaring headache and went cross-eyed (😊) without finding my plant. I could not find abelia with berries in the winter.

Only now, will I ask the forum if they can help with identification.

 

Believe it or not, when I started at Alamy, the forum wasn’t a friendly place so I had to figure it out completely by myself! It can be done. I’m not saying we won’t help you but you need to work it out yourself if you can before turning to us.  I have tried to help other people whenever I can. The forum recognizes this hard work on my part and when I need help, I always get it. Because really, it can be hard work helping others.

And whatever you do, don’t insinuate that we are unfriendly because we don’t give you every answer you desire. That will be a great way to never get help when you really need it, rather than want it.

Believe it or not, we want you to succeed.

Betty

[John Richmond]

11 hours ago, Betty LaRue said:

I took pictures of it in spring with flowers and butterflies years ago.

Can you post an image of that, Betty.  I'm trying to ID your image in the other thread but I can't narrow it down.