Tony ALS Posted July 23 Share Posted July 23 9 hours ago, Rubens Alarcon said: I was out of Novel use, but I opted in this month I did the same, but the only novel use is the one I posted earlier which is also Rights Managed and Editorial for $0.37 gross. My average so far this year is $12.35 so well below average it would seem. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russell Watkins Posted July 23 Share Posted July 23 $14.33 gross average for me this year. It's only that high because of one healthy sale amongst a sea of tiddlers. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Hyde Posted July 23 Share Posted July 23 My average gross is low compared to the figures people are quoting above at $12.9. I suppose that has to be weighed up against how many images you’re selling, which for me, so far, this year is 62. Considering the size of my portfolio I think it’s performing quite well. This month is pretty consistent with my usual sales pattern. To date one sale for $48 and then four others under $11. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Standfast Posted July 23 Share Posted July 23 Lets not get too despondent... In terms of licences year to date, I'm 18% up on the whole of 2020. However... the revenue is the same, so return per licence is way down. Sigh. Think I'll go and take some pictures...cheaply! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Ramsay Posted July 23 Share Posted July 23 $27.72 is my average so far this year, much the same as others. Comfortably over half last year's total sales and revenue at the halfway point of 30th June, though. Alex 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geogphotos Posted July 23 Share Posted July 23 48 minutes ago, Mr Standfast said: Lets not get too despondent... In terms of licences year to date, I'm 18% up on the whole of 2020. However... the revenue is the same, so return per licence is way down. Sigh. Think I'll go and take some pictures...cheaply! This was all I managed yesterday. https://www.geographyphotos.com/gallery/IDM2024-22July/G00000Kw7een.zVk/C0000TppbWwwqrwQ Clouds came over 😵💫 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wahavi Posted July 23 Share Posted July 23 My 2024 average is 49.44 (lowest 1.69 - highest 184). 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Scheuern Posted July 23 Share Posted July 23 My mean, so far, is $62.44, but I had a massive outlier with a $$$$ sale. The median, which is $19, is more representative. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Standfast Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 23 hours ago, geogphotos said: This was all I managed yesterday. https://www.geographyphotos.com/gallery/IDM2024-22July/G00000Kw7een.zVk/C0000TppbWwwqrwQ Clouds came over 😵💫 Ian Without looking at the caption where was I 🦔 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Betty LaRue Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 Mine is $29.17 so far for this year to date. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IKuzmin Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 (edited) On 23/07/2024 at 07:50, Mark Scheuern said: My mean, so far, is $62.44, but I had a massive outlier with a $$$$ sale. The median, which is $19, is more representative. Right, the median is way better for those whose sales are limited and not distributed normally, like myself. My average in 2024 is $36.4 but the median is $28.4. Both values are less than in 2023, which was less than in 2022, and so on. But these values cannot be detached from the number of sales. E.g., a person who sales 20 licenses x $2 still makes 2x than a person who sales 2 licenses x $10. What we gain blocking “cheap distribution options” is just an improvement of our “peace of mind” (me included). All things considered, if one wants to assess his/her own performance, the RPI value is the most integrative index. My RPI on Alamy is decreasing steadily during the last 2+years (I am not taking into account the slow Covid period) and getting very close to RPI that I have on a microstock site (for 2023 it was 0.33 on Alamy and 0.25 on a microstock; for this year I did not bother to calculate as it must be compared to the same period of the previous year(s); but it feels that it will be either the same or worse). Edited July 26 by IKuzmin 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geogphotos Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 8 hours ago, Mr Standfast said: Ian Without looking at the caption where was I 🦔 No. Baffled. Can I look? Lyneham Banks - don't know it, looks like a lovely spot for a picnic 😄 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Chapman Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 1 hour ago, IKuzmin said: Right, the median is way better for those whose sales are limited and not distributed normally, like myself. My average in 2024 is $36.4 but the median is $28.4. Both values are less than in 2023, which was less than in 2022, and so on. But these values cannot be detached from the number of sales. E.g., a person who sales 20 licenses x $2 still makes 2x than a person who sales 2 licenses x $10. What we gain blocking “cheap distribution options” is just an improvement of our “peace of mind” (me included). All things considered, if one wants to assess his/her own performance, the RPI value is the most integrative index. My RPI on Alamy is decreasing steadily during the last 2+years (I am not taking into account the slow Covid period) and getting very close to RPI that I have on a microstock site (for 2023 it was 0.18 on Alamy and 0.13 on a microstock; for this year I did not bother to calculate as it must be compared to the same period of the previous year(s); but it feels that it will be either the same or worse). Are you calculating RPI using gross or net sales revenue? Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geogphotos Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 6 minutes ago, geogphotos said: No. Baffled. Can I look? Lyneham Banks - don't know it, looks like a lovely spot for a picnic 😄 Now I know where it is. Blimey didn't know anything about this and have used that road in the past when we used to visit mother-in-law near Calne. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IKuzmin Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 (edited) 8 minutes ago, M.Chapman said: Are you calculating RPI using gross or net sales revenue? RPI = net incomed divided by the number of images in portfolio per a period of time, e.g. $2000 (net income during a year) / 4000 images (portfolio) = $0.5 per image per year. This reflects the return for time-effort, as we invest the time-effort not selling images but creating them. In fact, I came across this term on some stock forums when was just starting this venue ~15 years ago. Edited July 24 by IKuzmin 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Scheuern Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 (edited) 3 hours ago, IKuzmin said: RPI = net incomed divided by the number of images in portfolio per a period of time, e.g. $2000 (net income during a year) / 4000 images (portfolio) = $0.5 per image per year. This reflects the return for time-effort, as we invest the time-effort not selling images but creating them. In fact, I came across this term on some stock forums when was just starting this venue ~15 years ago. Ah, that's an interesting metric. I just estimated mine (using a reasonable guess for my average number of images for the last year, since it's increased) and I got $0.28/image/year, net, though again it's affected by that one big sale. And you're right, I probably don't have anything like a normal distribution, even with that one outlier eliminated. Now you have me wanting to make a graph... . Edited July 24 by Mark Scheuern Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffrey Isaac Greenberg Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 3 hours ago, IKuzmin said: RPI = net incomed divided by the number of images in portfolio per a period of time, e.g. $2000 (net income during a year) / 4000 images (portfolio) = $0.5 per image per year. This reflects the return for time-effort, as we invest the time-effort not selling images but creating them. (2) contribs could have same data, one over 3 yrs, other over 10 yrs so don't this only work for grand total of years, not per year...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IKuzmin Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 9 minutes ago, Jeffrey Isaac Greenberg said: (2) contribs could have same data, one over 3 yrs, other over 10 yrs so don't this only work for grand total of years, not per year...? Am not sure what you mean. I think per any period of time. If compare historically, or between outlets, that must be done for the same periods of time, e.g. RPI for 6 months of 2024 compared to RPI for 6 months of 2022 and so on. But otherwise yeah, one can calculate it monthly (particularly if number of sales is high and there is no large month-to-month variability), another one can calculate just once for a lifetime but this is not perhaps very helpful... say "Hey, I made 200,000 images, earned $1,000,000 (which turns to $5 per image in total) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffrey Isaac Greenberg Posted July 25 Share Posted July 25 3 hours ago, IKuzmin said: ...but this is not perhaps very helpful... say "Hey, I made 200,000 images, earned $1,000,000 (which turns to $5 per image in total) it is most helpful IMO; it tells me if I shoot (100) keepers in a day of travel & I spend, say, $200 on that day, I will ultimately typically realize 100 x $5net -- $200 = $300net profit for that day's effort... it won't be in my pocket quickly, but eventually it will... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Chapman Posted July 25 Share Posted July 25 (edited) 5 hours ago, Jeffrey Isaac Greenberg said: it is most helpful IMO; it tells me if I shoot (100) keepers in a day of travel & I spend, say, $200 on that day, I will ultimately typically realize 100 x $5net -- $200 = $300net profit for that day's effort... it won't be in my pocket quickly, but eventually it will... I think both metrics are useful, but I think Jeff's is harder to calculate? I don't keep data showing the revenue each image has created since upload and Alamy don't provide a report of this - I wish they did. I suppose a pivot table analysis would provide some insight. In 2023 my Alamy portfolio of around 5,700 images generated a total net revenue of $910, giving a net return of about $0.16/image/year in 2023. Over the same period my experimental micro-stock portfolio of about 500 images generated a total net revenue of $120, giving a net return of about $0.24/image/year. Although my experimental micro-stock portfolio generated a higher return / image I'm not adding to it. Images there have to be RF and infringements are impossible to track (no licence data). So, not only are my micro-stock images sold for much much lower fees, I find them circulated widely with no idea which uses are legit. Mark Edited July 25 by M.Chapman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IKuzmin Posted July 25 Share Posted July 25 4 hours ago, M.Chapman said: I think both metrics are useful, but I think Jeff's is harder to calculate? As it can only be calculated retrospectively, it is useless otherwise. The only way to use it as a predictor is to calculate for a certain period of past time and extrapolate. However, given that it changes in time, such generalization for long periods would not help as well. In contract, if calculate for reasonable short periods of time, like years, it helps to evaluate dynamics or make comparisons between outlets. 4 hours ago, M.Chapman said: Although my experimental micro-stock portfolio generated a higher return / image Interesting comparison between Alamy vs microstock performance. I too have a smaller portfolio of worse images at a microstock site, and they historically showed RPI ~2.5x worse than my portfolio on Alamy, but since 2023 this difference shortens progressively becoming negligible at present time. As for uncontrolled circulation, I noted the same for my images, but I think the same happens (or may happen) with RF images on Alamy. As I discussed with some publisher which used repeatedly my images downloaded once from a microstock years ago, this is permitted for RF license. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Chapman Posted July 25 Share Posted July 25 In line with Jeff Greenberg's comments I attempted to estimate total return per image using some pivot tables. My Alamy results as follows* In 2010 I uploaded 55 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $374 (about $7/image) In 2011 I uploaded 392 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $1,105 (about $3/image) In 2012 I uploaded 350 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $545 (about $1.5/image) In 2013 I uploaded 366 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $1,161 (about $3/image) In 2014 I uploaded 541 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $1,646 (about $3/image) In 2015 I uploaded 211 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $735 (about $3.5/image) In 2016 I uploaded 320 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $232 (about $0.7/image) In 2017 I uploaded 684 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $882 (about $1.30/image) In 2018 I uploaded 632 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $679 (about $1/image) In 2019 I uploaded 718 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $772 (about $1/image) In 2020 I uploaded 416 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $354 (about $0.85/image) The drop year by year is to be expected as images have had less and less time to build up sales, our commission on sales has been reduced and average licence fees have fallen. But from 2020 my numbers fall off a cliff. Maybe sales of my recent images very poor, or just not been on sale long enough for sales to appear? *The above analysis is far from perfect because I also culled about 10% of my collection when the new contract came in, and some images have been replaced with enhanced versions. But it gives a flavour. Mark 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IKuzmin Posted July 25 Share Posted July 25 (edited) 3 hours ago, M.Chapman said: In line with Jeff Greenberg's comments I attempted to estimate total return per image using some pivot tables. My Alamy results as follows* In 2010 I uploaded 55 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $374 (about $7/image) In 2011 I uploaded 392 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $1,105 (about $3/image) In 2012 I uploaded 350 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $545 (about $1.5/image) In 2013 I uploaded 366 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $1,161 (about $3/image) In 2014 I uploaded 541 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $1,646 (about $3/image) In 2015 I uploaded 211 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $735 (about $3.5/image) In 2016 I uploaded 320 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $232 (about $0.7/image) In 2017 I uploaded 684 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $882 (about $1.30/image) In 2018 I uploaded 632 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $679 (about $1/image) In 2019 I uploaded 718 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $772 (about $1/image) In 2020 I uploaded 416 images which have returned a total net sales revenue since then of $354 (about $0.85/image) These are my RPI values calculate in the conventional way ($net for a year divided by the number of images in portfolio at the beginning of that year): Year RPI 2016 1.048923 2017 1.085627 2018 0.813563 2019 0.73939 2020 0.594491 2021 0.607785 2022 0.624797 2023 0.332817 Edited July 25 by IKuzmin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffrey Isaac Greenberg Posted July 26 Share Posted July 26 17 hours ago, M.Chapman said: ...but I think Jeff's is harder to calculate? Mark mate my favorite metric: last year's total net income (2 agencies 2023) ÷ last year's total number of images in play; then divide result into an upcoming travel itinerary overhead $$ to determine how many genuine new keepers must be gained after which profit will be realized eventually.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Chapman Posted July 26 Share Posted July 26 19 hours ago, Jeffrey Isaac Greenberg said: Mark mate my favorite metric: last year's total net income (2 agencies 2023) ÷ last year's total number of images in play; then divide result into an upcoming travel itinerary overhead $$ to determine how many genuine new keepers must be gained after which profit will be realized eventually.... That's the metric I usually use too. As stated above; My Alamy portfolio of around 5,700 images generated a total net revenue of $910 in 2023, giving a net return of about $0.16/image/year NB. The Net Revenue included $210 of infringement revenue (via Alamy) Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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