Let's talk about National Geographic!

[Homy]

I didn't find any news discussion threads but thought this was such an important news that all the photography communities should know about. I hope the discussion doesn't get erased and it makes some of you to get involved and help in anyway you can.

There are not many news articles about this and the news is spreading slowly but Disney has decided to suddenly shut down this large photo site and also NG Traveler Magazine after October 31th. I've been a member of National Geographic's community Yourshot since 2015 and have been lucky enough to get two of my photos published in their stories. It's one of the largest photo sites and communities with over 1 000 000 photographers/members from around the globe. It's a unique community with dedicated editors and producers who arrange assignments, give personal feedback and encourage the members every day. Then they choose and publish a selection of the submitted photos and you also have chance to get published in the magazine. There is also Photo of the day, Daily Dozen and Editors' Spotlight and more. Everybody has a chance, pro or amateur.

The site is now suddenly abandoned with no updates and feels like Titanic, a sinking ship with no crew. The news has struck the community like a lightning and there are attempts to make the decision makers to change their mind by contacting them, signing a petition and spreading the news to media.

 

It's a very sad situation that such a huge archive and years of work hours by the staff and the members will be lost. Maybe some of you already are on Yourshot but if you want to know more go to the site and read the discussions to find out how you can help.

 

Please let this thread remain Alamy if you love photography and National Geographic! Maybe there is something Alamy can do to make a statement?

 

Everytime you visit the site now you get the following message:

 

To our Your Shot community:

 

As of October 31, 2019, the current Your Shot platform will be discontinued and all engagement, assignments, and promotion of photos from our community will occur on National Geographic’s Instagram Your Shot feed. As a reminder, any images you have shared on the platform are subject to the Terms of Use and may be used by National Geographic in the continued promotion of Your Shot. Please refer to our Terms of Use sharing and use for more information on this.

 

We are pleased to offer professionals and budding talents alike the opportunity to share their work, receive expert feedback and be featured on our platforms. We are excited about the move to Your Shot’s Instagram, as the community on that platform is over 2 million strong. This change will enable a robust continued conversation about photos and visual storytelling before and among a large and engaged audience. Find us if you haven’t already at @natgeoyourshot

 

Thank you for sharing your moments with us.

 

Please check back in the coming weeks, as we will provide you with the option to download the photos you have uploaded to the Your Shot Community.

Edited September 6, 2019 by Homy

[meanderingemu]

curious,  how much were the licensing fees compared to a typical Alamy one?

[Michael Ventura]

I am very sad to see Nat Geo Traveler shuttling down.  I, very recently, had meals with two editors and there was no mention of the closing of the magazine. I don’t think the even knew yet.  I had done a few small assignments and sold some direct stock.  If my memory serves me, they paid $350/day, plus expenses, for assignments and $250 per photo for inside the magazine use.  They regularly bought Alamy stock but not sure what the rate structure was for those sales.

[Homy]

5 hours ago, meanderingemu said:

curious,  how much were the licensing fees compared to a typical Alamy one?

 

Yourshot is purely a photo community, not a photo agency like Alamy. You don't sell or buy anything. It is National Geographic's portal for common people all around the world who are interested in the art of photo, offering everyone a chance to participate, get feedback and even get published. Of course if you get published in the paper magazine or their photo books you get compensation. For me it took 2,5 years to be published in a story online for the first time. It was such a honour and the best thing that happened to me as a hobby photographer. Check out their assignments and stories to get a picture of how it works (worked).

Edited September 6, 2019 by Homy

[wiskerke]

Shouldn't we be happy they're closing down their supply of free images? After all they did/do pay us over here for use in the magazines.  I'm quite sure some of ours were even shown as if coming from that community, but were in fact bought from Alamy.

How would I know? Hmm what do you think 😁

 

I'm pretty sure Disney is not shutting down Nat Geo Traveler at all.

 

As for the YS website, they're moving over to Instagram. It's a simple case of the king is dead, long live the new king. I'm guessing they didn't even have to do a lot of research to decide to move to Insta. If at all. I mean have these users been living under a rock the size of Mars:

-via Oberlo

 

(hmm maybe I'm getting my analogies mixed up here).

Anyway under that Petapixel article there somewhere was a link to a new formed Flickr group, which seems a very appropriate platform.

 

wim

[John Mitchell]

10 hours ago, Michael Ventura said:

I am very sad to see Nat Geo Traveler shuttling down.  I, very recently, had meals with two editors and there was no mention of the closing of the magazine. I don’t think the even knew yet.  I had done a few small assignments and sold some direct stock.  If my memory serves me, they paid $350/day, plus expenses, for assignments and $250 per photo for inside the magazine use.  They regularly bought Alamy stock but not sure what the rate structure was for those sales.

 

I used to license the occasional image directly to NGT as well. The going fee was $250 as you say. They even e-mailed me picture requests for awhile. I'd be surprised if the magazine is closing down, though. They have an affluent readership and a very large circulation.

Edited September 6, 2019 by John Mitchell

[meanderingemu]

5 hours ago, John Mitchell said:

 

I used to license the occasional image directly to NGT as well. The going fee was $250 as you say. They even e-mailed me picture requests for awhile. I'd be surprised if the magazine is closing down, though. They have an affluent readership and a very large circulation.

and they still advertise subscriptions, which would be bad if they are closing 

 

so all is lost is a web based site where people gave away pictures, if i understand correctly. 

[John Mitchell]

5 hours ago, meanderingemu said:

and they still advertise subscriptions, which would be bad if they are closing 

 

so all is lost is a web based site where people gave away pictures, if i understand correctly. 

 

It does sound like a rumour. However, magazines are having a lot of trouble these days, so I guess you never know.

 

I wonder if NGT every uses Alamy images. Probably not.

Edited September 6, 2019 by John Mitchell

[Michael Ventura]

16 minutes ago, John Mitchell said:

I wonder if NGT every uses Alamy images. Probably not.

 

Actually, they have used Alamy photos in nearly every issue for many years.  I report them on the "Have you found" threads.  I have posted several cover uses as well!  been a subscriber, to the U.S. edition, since it's launch back in the mid 1980s....to keep costs down, they have been using more stock than assignment in the last five or more years. I sent an email to an editor friend this morning to see if the rumors are true and waiting to hear back.  I will post what she says here.

 

[John Mitchell]

10 minutes ago, Michael Ventura said:

 

Actually, they have used Alamy photos in nearly every issue for many years.  I report them on the "Have you found" threads.  I have posted several cover uses as well!  been a subscriber, to the U.S. edition, since it's launch back in the mid 1980s....to keep costs down, they have been using more stock than assignment in the last five or more years. I sent an email to an editor friend this morning to see if the rumors are true and waiting to hear back.  I will post what she says here.

 

 

That's interesting to hear. Where have I been, I wonder. I obviously need to check the images found threads more thoroughly. Have to admit that I don't read travel mags as much as used to. Keep us posted.

[Lisa]

I sold a photo to National Geographic Traveler magazine via Alamy back in 2014.

[Homy]

On 06/09/2019 at 05:14, wiskerke said:

Shouldn't we be happy they're closing down their supply of free images? After all they did/do pay us over here for use in the magazines.  I'm quite sure some of ours were even shown as if coming from that community, but were in fact bought from Alamy.

How would I know? Hmm what do you think 😁

 

I'm pretty sure Disney is not shutting down Nat Geo Traveler at all.

 

As for the YS website, they're moving over to Instagram. It's a simple case of the king is dead, long live the new king. I'm guessing they didn't even have to do a lot of research to decide to move to Insta. If at all. I mean have these users been living under a rock the size of Mars:

 -via Oberlo

 

On 06/09/2019 at 13:14, meanderingemu said:

and they still advertise subscriptions, which would be bad if they are closing 

 

so all is lost is a web based site where people gave away pictures, if i understand correctly. 

 

I think I have explained enough but I guess if one never has been a part of Yourshot or similar communities and is only interested in selling photos and not the other aspects mentioned above it can be difficult to understand what it is about. Then it’s easy to see the Yourshot site and community only as a place where people ”living under a rock” ”give away their pictures”.

 

No, I haven’t been living under a rock or a fool giving away my photos for free, and neither all the other well-know and professional photographers at Yourshot from around the world. I use Alamy for selling images and Yourshot for the love of the art, discussing, getting feedback and recognized. As I also mentioned they do pay the community members for the usage of their photos in print. Otherwise it’s just like any other photo site where the submitted  images can be used for promotion of the site and its competitions.

 

No, they’re not moving to Instagram since they’ve already been there for a long time. They’re moving all the activities to Instagram and it’s not because of the 1 billion users. It only has financial reasons since they get all the hardware and software solutions for free, instead of having their own site and simply because Disney is more into making money of movies than passionate about photography. I myself prefer the quality of personal feedback from professional editors and producers to the quantity of 1 billion users.

 

I’m surprised that people and particularly other photographers compare Instagram to Yourshot and think we should be happy that such a great community disappears. Instagram is a social media. It’s for following and liking, a place where images only last for seconds and disappear among millions of other. Since Instagram changed its algorithm you get less exposure too. It’s one reason for me and many others not being so active on the platform anymore. Many photographers don’t even use Instagram and many have abandoned the platform. It also lacks several features like discussion boards and hi-res photos. Sitting for hours and posting your own photos or looking at others on a tiny cell phone display is not good for your eyes either. People don’t even have time to get engaged or read the caption. They share or steal your photos without even giving credit or edit them with filters and crop them to make them their own with much less respect for the photo or the photographer. Yes, that risk exists everywhere online but Instagram can never replace a dedicated photo site and community in my opinion. There are also other sites like Photocrowd, Viewbug and Gurushots but none of them can match Yourshot and the same high level of interaction and feedback from the staff and other members. I myself prefer the quality of personal feedback from professional editors and producers over the quantity of 1 billion users.

 

Regarding the Traveler magazine I read the news about the shutdown in this article.

 

I hoped that some of you at least would support the petition but reading the answers and the fact that only a tiny fraction of Alamy is active here I guess it’s simply not the right place, to my surprise. No problem, at least I tried.

Edited September 8, 2019 by Homy

[NYCat]

I looked around it a bit for fun and was impressed by the wonderful photos. Certainly a great place to see wildlife photos.

 

Paulette

[wiskerke]

24 minutes ago, Homy said:

 

 

I think I have explained enough but I guess if one never has been a part of Yourshot or similar communities and is only interested in selling photos and not the other aspects mentioned above it can be difficult to understand what it is about. Then it’s easy to see the Yourshot site and community only as a place where people ”living under a rock” ”give away their pictures”.

 

No, I haven’t been living under a rock or a fool giving away my photos for free, and neither all the other well-know and professional photographers at Yourshot from around the world. I use Alamy for selling images and Yourshot for the love of the art, discussing, getting feedback and recognized. As I also mentioned they do pay the community members for the usage of their photos in print. Otherwise it’s just like any other photo site where the submitted  images can be used for promotion of the site and its competitions.

 

No, they’re not moving to Instagram since they’ve already been there for a long time. They’re moving all the activities to Instagram and it’s not because of the 1 billion users. It only has financial reasons since they get all the hardware and software solutions for free, instead of having their own site and simply because Disney is more into making money of movies than passionate about photography.

 

I’m surprised that people and particularly other photographers compare Instagram to Yourshot and think we should be happy that such a great community disappears. Instagram is a social media. It’s for following and liking, a place where images only last for seconds and disappear among millions of other. Since Instagram changed its algorithm you get less exposure too. It’s one reason for me and many others not being so active on the platform anymore. Many photographers don’t even use Instagram and many have abandoned the platform. It also lacks several features like discussion boards and hi-res photos. Sitting for hours and posting your own photos or looking at others on a tiny cell phone display is not good for your eyes either. People don’t even have time to get engaged or read the caption. They share or steal your photos without even giving credit or edit them with filters and crop them to make them their own with much less respect for the photo or the photographer. Yes, that risk exists everywhere online but Instagram can never replace a dedicated photo site and community in my opinion. There are also other sites like Photocrowd, Viewbug and Gurushots but none of them can match Yourshot and the same high level of interaction and feedback from the staff and other members.

 

Regarding the Traveler magazine I read the news about the shutdown in this article.

 

I hoped that some of you at least would support the petition but reading the answers and the fact that only a tiny fraction of Alamy is active here I guess it’s simply not the right place, to my surprise. No problem, at least I tried.

 

You're completely right about Instagram i think. I don't use it. However for a brand it's a different thing. And even for photographers wanting to make money. Because all the influencers make more than all the those photographers just doing stock.

I'm not sure Disney is to blame. They are just not interested in having a camera club. Or any community probably other than on Facebook and Instagram. And looking at it from a business standpoint probably rightly so. Which is where the rock comes in. This has been going on for years now. Young people are on Instagram and it does function as the modern equivalent of a camera club. (Older folk are on Facebook and it serves as their community.)

Flickr otoh is like an old fashion camera club and is the perfect place to move to with a platform like Yourshot. Will you be safe there, now that's owned by Smugmug? Of course not. That too  is a company that needs to make money.

 

So why not set up  your own website TPFKAYS.com The Platform Formerly Known AS Your Shot?

My guess is you already know the answer.

 

wim

[Homy]

4 hours ago, wiskerke said:

I'm not sure Disney is to blame. They are just not interested in having a camera club. Or any community probably other than on Facebook and Instagram. And looking at it from a business standpoint probably rightly so.

 

Flickr otoh is like an old fashion camera club and is the perfect place to move to with a platform like Yourshot. Will you be safe there, now that's owned by Smugmug? Of course not. That too  is a company that needs to make money.

 

So why not set up  your own website TPFKAYS.com The Platform Formerly Known AS Your Shot?

My guess is you already know the answer.

 

wim

 

I'm already on Flickr and pay for a yearly pro subscription since they started to limit the free accounts. Another thing people may not know is how Disney has handled the situation. No member of Your shot has got any messages about the shutdown, besides the pop-up window when you visit the site. Many don't even know yet that the site will disappear next month. Also there have been no discussions or suggestions about  how we could solve the problem. Many members are willing to pay for a subscription like Flickr's to keep the site alive but they have just closed the door and thrown away the key. There are also three active stories which were supposed to be published this month but now all seem to be abandoned without further notice.

[Michael Ventura]

I just got word back from the Director of Photography of Traveler magazine, that it is true that the next print issue (dec/Jan issue) of the North American edition of National Geographic Traveler, will be the last.  They will continue online only.

[John Mitchell]

2 hours ago, Michael Ventura said:

I just got word back from the Director of Photography of Traveler magazine, that it is true that the next print issue (dec/Jan issue) of the North American edition of National Geographic Traveler, will be the last.  They will continue online only.

 

Sorry to that that. It's a common pattern, though. Most of the print magazines that I worked when I was doing freelance travel writing in addition to photography have either folded or gone the online-only route. I guess a lot of tree have been saved, but the online freelancing business model just didn't work for me.

[John Mitchell]

I came across this announcement. It sounds as if National Geographic magazine plans to pick up some of the slack by covering more travel.

 

Also, it looks like some local (non-US) editions of NGT will continue to be published.

Edited September 10, 2019 by John Mitchell

[Phil]

On 07/09/2019 at 14:55, wiskerke said:

 

You're completely right about Instagram i think. I don't use it. However for a brand it's a different thing. And even for photographers wanting to make money. Because all the influencers make more than all the those photographers just doing stock.

I'm not sure Disney is to blame. They are just not interested in having a camera club. Or any community probably other than on Facebook and Instagram. And looking at it from a business standpoint probably rightly so. Which is where the rock comes in. This has been going on for years now. Young people are on Instagram and it does function as the modern equivalent of a camera club. (Older folk are on Facebook and it serves as their community.)

 

Yes - for bigger Brands Instagram is a major marketing platform. No doubt why Disney ditched Yourshot, etc. 

 

I used IG on/off for a few years. But earlier this year decided it wasn't worth it as a small-time photographer.  My IG feed was clogged with 1/3 being advertisements despite efforts to use IG's tools to manage them. 

 

The large Brands have/are flocking to IG but can devote large resources to it as a new-age marketing platform.

 

It just eludes me how IG is useful to small photographers in any meaningful way.

 

Facebook's re-direction/emphasis encouraged more use of FB Groups. After joining numerous appropriate FB Groups - FB  instituted changes in how Sharing works with Groups. So FB has become less and less helpful as well.

 

My take-away is both IG and FB are of little-no help in small time photographer quests to use these social media platforms for marketing their photography. 

Edited September 21, 2019 by Phil

[Tony Collins]

I used to be active on https://www.blipfoto.com/ which was set up (I think?) by an Alamy contributor) It nearly disappeared but is still going.

[Johnnie5]

Knowing that the former majority stakeholder of Time Warner was Rupert Murdoch who has been instrumental in driving down the prices that content creators receive it’s not surprising that they would create something like Your Shot.  I guess Disney doesn’t need it any more.