Children's Art - Pre-war?

[geogphotos]

Image removed for copyright reasons

 

This is on a magic lantern slide. How could it be colour - only a few are colour - the majority in monochrome.

 

It looks like the child is saying goodbye and his furniture is being loaded into van. 

 

What do you think? Not sure what I do with these - have around 40 from an auction.

Edited September 15, 2023 by geogphotos

[Allan Bell]

Early lantern slides were hand painted probably in oils thinned down with varnish or turpentine or mix of both so light would shine through.

 

Allan

 

[Mr Standfast]

Alan, yes. I think I remember hand tinting kits were still advertised in the late 70's??

 

Ian, is there a woman with a bird in a cage on any of the other slides?

 

"Ok I'll explain myself...

 

The bedstead reminded me of the moving house song from 1919 "My Old Man Said Follow The Van".

 

My old man said "Foller the van,

And don't dilly dally on the way".

Off went the van wiv me 'ome packed in it,

I walked behind wiv me old cock linnet. ^*

But I dillied and dallied, dallied and I dillied

Lost me way and don't know where to roam.

Well you can't trust a special like the old time coppers.

When you can't find your way 'ome.

 

After a Mackeson or three my Aunt Ada used to sing

 

"Who'll put you up when you've lost your bedstead, and you can't find your way 'ome?"

 

Any way, it was a red herring.

 

 

 

 

Edited September 14, 2023 by Mr Standfast
So many....

[wiskerke]

The car may be a bit too detailed for a child's drawing. Same for the yellow outlines.

I would do a quick scan with Google Lens on your phone to see if you haven't stumbled upon some Lowryesque folk artist.

No hits for this one btw. (Google; Yandex; Bing; Baidu; Tineye.)

 

wim

Edited September 13, 2023 by wiskerke
typo

[geogphotos]

You deserve some more!!

31 minutes ago, Allan Bell said:

Early lantern slides were hand painted probably in oils thinned down with varnish or turpentine or mix of both so light would shine through.

 

Allan

 

 

 

Yes but this is an image of a picture. It hasn't been painted on the glass. 

[geogphotos]

Images removed for copyright reasons

 

 

 

Edited September 15, 2023 by geogphotos

[geogphotos]

 

 

Images removed for copyright reasons

 

 

Edited September 15, 2023 by geogphotos

[geogphotos]

This one looks very like Michael Gove.😀

 

'The man I meet on my way to school' by Kenneth Nunn 6 years

 

Image removed for copyright reasons

Edited September 15, 2023 by geogphotos

[geogphotos]

Images removed for copyright reasons

 

 

 

This next one by Violet White 13 years 11 months

 

 

Edited September 15, 2023 by geogphotos

[Gorilla Dave]

…fascinating pictures !   

My guess is that someone has documented some sort of children’s art exhibition, or maybe winners from different age groups in a competition. Or they may represent a collection of children’s art made over a period of time – looks like 1930s & 40s.
The Belisha Beacon featured in the first pic dates the scene to no earlier than 1935. The picture might be a representation of a wartime evacuation.

If only a few are in colour that might be because the originator felt that the process of having them colourised / hand painted was too time consuming / costly.
 
If you’re not sure what to do with them, would you want to sell them ! ?

 

GD

[Jeffrey Isaac Greenberg]

when one becomes owner of someone else's intellectual property,

does copyright transfer to new owner?

how does one know if slide is original or copy, does it matter?
if I buy famous contemporary painting, can I license-control its images?

🤔___🤔___🤔HELP ME UNDERSTAND

[wiskerke]

4 hours ago, Gorilla Dave said:

<>Belisha Beacon<>

Well spotted!

 

wim

[geogphotos]

At first I thought that they were older but I also spotted the belisha beacon and looked up the date they came in. Is it SE12 on the removal van?

 

Not sure if they are colourised - suppose that they must be - was there some sort of early colour film? 

 

I don't own copyright so can't use them for stock.

 

I'm thinking of creating a gallery on my website. - I'll post the link here. I might use some to make birthday cards for friends.  An artist friend suggested that they might come from a Royal Academy exhibition so I sent an email and she will also enquire through contacts.

 

Thanks for the offer about selling but I have only just bought them and still enjoying going through them. I'll hang on to them as they don't take up much space.

Edited September 14, 2023 by geogphotos

[geogphotos]

7 hours ago, Jeffrey Isaac Greenberg said:

when one becomes owner of someone else's intellectual property,

does copyright transfer to new owner?

how does one know if slide is original or copy, does it matter?
if I buy famous contemporary painting, can I license-control its images?

🤔___🤔___🤔HELP ME UNDERSTAND

 

 

As I said above I do not have copyright for these chidlren's art pictures.

 

But I do have it - written copyright transfer to me - for others. Click on my 'Images' link to see some recent ones.

 

In total I have copied over 4000 of these by now. And yes they do sell.  I also have the motivation of 'saving' some of these old pics from the mid 1950s onwards. That was the first time when ordinary people had access to decent cameras and film, and now as the photographers die their familes often don't have any interest and the slides end up being dumped, collections split up ( people like to pick out ones of ships, trains, etc and then pass on the rest), put on sale in auctions, and just disposed of.

 

One outstanding collection I bought at auction still had a sticky 'post it note' saying 'Dump' on it - somehow it ended up at the auction. Those were taken in 1956 by a UK teacher on exchange in Australia who went on several fieldtrips from Melbourne Grammar school to explore Australia, including being some of the first tourists to visit what they called Ayers Rock. They stayed overnight at Curtin Springs Station and I was able to make an image available to the people who run a campsite/farming business there - they recognised one of the corrugated iron sheds as having been built by their father in that year when he took on the cattle outpost. No I didn 't charge them a fee ( they provided location information)!  I had to use some detective work to track down the photographer's family and they kindly gave me permission.

 

I can't always get copyright and that is frustrating. Even when I trace the family it must seem a bit wierd being contacted out of the blue by a stranger and some people are suspicious and unreceptive. 

 

There is no system in place for these 'Orphan Works'. The actual Orphan Works office will only issue a licence when there is a specific publishing use in mind and not simply for offering pics for stock. There might be a way around that but I am busy enough with what I have.

 

For photos copyright in UK is 70 years after the creator's death and passes, just like any other property, to their heir ( who most likely doesn't realise that they own it!)

Edited September 14, 2023 by geogphotos

[Allan Bell]

I have tried searching for the image in your original post with Google images, using a multitude of connotations, from the 1930"s to the 1960"s but to no avail.

 

Allan

 

[wiskerke]

2 hours ago, geogphotos said:

Not sure if they are colourised - suppose that they must be - was there some sort of early colour film?

Autochrome dates from 1907 and was widely used. Colors are a bit more muted than your slide.

Modern subtractive reversal film came about in the mid 1930s with Kodak and Agfa, but several additive processes were available throughout the first half of the century.

I think we did have a quest to determine an early process here at some point. One with a distinct halftone pattern.

 

For archival use, but maybe also for stock, I think it would be a good idea to copy some if not all with the slide frames and the label(s) as well.

And for stock also some more of boxes and heaps of slides in different phases of being thrown away / being rescued. And maybe some more of the process. I'm thinking of articles telling people how to handle their old family photos.

 

wim

[geogphotos]

Images removed for copyright reasons

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 15, 2023 by geogphotos

[wiskerke]

Lovely stuff.

Possible concepts: traditional family families social patterns values naive innocent original simple outsider folk painting drawing art.

And a description of what is in the scene of course, but maybe also with the feelings a child (or the parent or the cat) may have.

1950s family: 12 searches for the rolling year.

1960s family: 9

1950s: 43 pages (#100)

1960s: 45 pages

family: 90 pages

 

wim

[Gorilla Dave]

7 hours ago, geogphotos said:

  An artist friend suggested that they might come from a Royal Academy exhibition so I sent an email and she will also enquire through contacts.

 

 

 

...would be great to learn more about them.

a website gallery sounds a good idea.

[geogphotos]

56 minutes ago, Gorilla Dave said:

 

...would be great to learn more about them.

a website gallery sounds a good idea.

 

 

Wouldn't it be great to find some of the artists? 

[Mr Standfast]

It's a treasure!

[Sandi]

I looked at the drawings yesterday and thought the school-yard/roadside one made me think very late 1920's / early 1930s from the fashions, Women have short hair, girls dressed in short gymslips - reminded me of photos of my mum as a young school girl in the Manchester.

[geogphotos]

2 hours ago, Sandi said:

I looked at the drawings yesterday and thought the school-yard/roadside one made me think very late 1920's / early 1930s from the fashions, Women have short hair, girls dressed in short gymslips - reminded me of photos of my mum as a young school girl in the Manchester.

 

I agree with you that they have a 1920s look. Perhaps they were taken over a period of years.

[geogphotos]

Out of curiosity I colourised three of the monochrome pictures that I previously posted here:

 

 

 

Edited October 2, 2023 by geogphotos