The video thread

[John Mitchell]

1 hour ago, Joseph Clemson said:

 

Two versions of the same clip is not an approach I've ever tried and in some agencies may fall foul of a reluctance to accept similars.. To the extent that one can see what sells on video stock sites, I don't get the impression that minimal processed bland clips sell especially well, though I can see their attractiveness to the professional colourist. I also have a feeling that unprocessed video is of most benefit when it comes from high end speciaist video cameras and terms I barely understand like uncompresed, raw and logging are bandied about. Such as this is far above my level of knowledge or experience and seems likely to remain so. 

 

It does seem that most of the footage that sells has been "improved." However, given what P5 recommends, I think I might try uploading two versions, associating them (hopefully) with the same keywords.

 

P5 says this about uploading multiple formats: "We recommend associating clips when you have multiple versions available."

 

Perhaps they aren't too concerned about other types of similars as well.

[Phil Robinson]

12 hours ago, John Mitchell said:

 

Thanks. I'll give that a try. Shooting "stills" in RAW has made me a bit lazy about exposure, which I'm discovering has to be right on with videos or you get some unsightly results that can't be corrected. I'm slowly getting the hang of Shotcut. So far, so good...

I've quickly learned it's better to err on the side of underexposure. It's much easier to get a reasonable result using Levels when the detail is there, even if a bit dark. Burned-out highlights are lost forever.

[BobD]

For the first time I did a little messing around today, I must say I impressed with the D850 4K quality.

After editing do any of you change the codec. I generally use quicktime with apple pro res 422 but this takes time to export. Is there much difference from the original H264.

[MDM]

1 hour ago, BobD said:

For the first time I did a little messing around today, I must say I impressed with the D850 4K quality.

After editing do any of you change the codec. I generally use quicktime with apple pro res 422 but this takes time to export. Is there much difference from the original H264.

H.264 is an acquisition and output codec but is not designed for editing. So depending on what editing software and system you are using, you will normally transcode into an editing codec such as one of the ProRes flavours in Final Cut Pro say on a Mac. QuickTime has extremely limited editing functionality. I think iMovie which also comes free with MacOS would be a better bet for starters. 
 

You can output the edited video in various formats in ProRes, H.264 or something else depending on the intended end use. One thing that is very confusing is the relationship between input, editing and output codecs as well as file formats and containers. Word has it that H.264’s days are numbered. 

Edited August 10, 2021 by MDM

[John Mitchell]

2 hours ago, BobD said:

For the first time I did a little messing around today, I must say I impressed with the D850 4K quality.

After editing do any of you change the codec. I generally use quicktime with apple pro res 422 but this takes time to export. Is there much difference from the original H264.

 

Do you find that you license 4K video as often as HD  -- i.e. is there much demand for 4K?

 

 I edit the original Sony AVCHD files produced by my camera, which export as MP4. I then convert the edited MP4 clips to .mov (QuickTime) before uploading. The codec always seems to be H.264, which I don't fiddle with because all this stuff is Martian to me. 👽

 

 

Edited August 10, 2021 by John Mitchell

[BobD]

8 minutes ago, John Mitchell said:

 

Do you find that you license 4K video as often as HD  -- i.e. is there much demand for 4K?

 

 I edit the original Sony AVCHD files produced by my camera, which export as MP4. I then convert the edited MP4 clips to .mov (QuickTime) before uploading. The codec always seems to be H.264, which I don't fiddle with because all this stuff is Martian to me. 👽

 

 

HD sells much more than 4K but it's nice when you get a 4K sale. Also I look on it as a little measure of future proofing.

[BobD]

1 hour ago, MDM said:

H.264 is an acquisition and output codec but is not designed for editing. So depending on what editing software and system you are using, you will normally transcode into an editing codec such as one of the ProRes flavours in Final Cut Pro say on a Mac. QuickTime has extremely limited editing functionality. I think iMovie which also comes free with MacOS would be a better bet for starters. 
 

You can output the edited video in various formats in ProRes, H.264 or something else depending on the intended end use. One thing that is very confusing is the relationship between input, editing and output codecs as well as file formats and containers. Word has it that H.264’s days are numbered. 

 

I am using Premier pro and after effects.

As all my previous videos have been after effects animations there has been no conversions, I just export as quicktime prores 422.

If I do more standard videos I will have to look into it further.

[John Mitchell]

I often check the 'latest footage sold' thread on the P5 forum. Someone reported a sale today, and I had a peek at his collection. This person looks to have a lot of experience with video. He also has an excellent eye for subject matter. His videos look to me to be totally unprocessed -- i.e. bland and ready to be corrected to the liking of the end-user. Hmmm...

 

 

 

Edited August 11, 2021 by John Mitchell

[Vincent Lowe]

I was chatting to my brother today, he 'messes about', as he put it, with video.  He has tried Shotcut but reckons it's 'crap' (his words, not mine..).  He swears by avs4you -  https://www.avs4you.com/

 

Not free but there's an offer on at the moment until the end of August.  I've not tried either of these programs myself so don't shoot the messenger...🙂

[John Mitchell]

9 minutes ago, Vincent Lowe said:

I was chatting to my brother today, he 'messes about', as he put it, with video.  He has tried Shotcut but reckons it's 'crap' (his words, not mine..).  He swears by avs4you -  https://www.avs4you.com/

 

Not free but there's an offer on at the moment until the end of August.  I've not tried either of these programs myself so don't shoot the messenger...🙂

 

Can't really comment on how crappy Shotcut is since I've only tried a couple of other programs. However, it seems fine for minor adjustments -- i.e. for preparing short video clips -- and after all it is free.

 

I downloaded the free avs4you video converter to add to my collection. Thanks for the link.

[Joseph Clemson]

3 hours ago, Vincent Lowe said:

I was chatting to my brother today, he 'messes about', as he put it, with video.  He has tried Shotcut but reckons it's 'crap' (his words, not mine..).  He swears by avs4you -  https://www.avs4you.com/

 

Not free but there's an offer on at the moment until the end of August.  I've not tried either of these programs myself so don't shoot the messenger...🙂

 

Hello Vincent, Thanks for pointing out this one. This program seems to be aimed at the consumer level, rather than someone aiming to edit files for profesional use. I haven't downloaded the program to try it out, but the screentour suggests features like the colour adjustment is done at a very simple level - no access to the separate colour channels, for example. I wouldn't write it off if someone is just looking to set out to learn a little about video editing, but not I'm so sure for what people here are likely to be working on.

 

I did download the AVS video convertor as I'm looking for a facility to convert my old collection of M2T files (from the Canon HV20) to DNxHD, for editing in Davinci Resolve. The AVS convertor can read the M2T files, but doesn't offer DNxHD or ProRes as export options. So, I'm still searching for a convertor which will do that job, if any one can help?

[John Mitchell]

18 minutes ago, Joseph Clemson said:

 

Hello Vincent, Thanks for pointing out this one. This program seems to be aimed at the consumer level, rather than someone aiming to edit files for profesional use. I haven't downloaded the program to try it out, but the screentour suggests features like the colour adjustment is done at a very simple level - no access to the separate colour channels, for example. I wouldn't write it off if someone is just looking to set out to learn a little about video editing, but not I'm so sure for what people here are likely to be working on.

 

I did download the AVS video convertor as I'm looking for a facility to convert my old collection of M2T files (from the Canon HV20) to DNxHD, for editing in Davinci Resolve. The AVS convertor can read the M2T files, but doesn't offer DNxHD or ProRes as export options. So, I'm still searching for a convertor which will do that job, if any one can help?

 

By "this program seems to be aimed..." do you mean Shotcut or AVS?

[Joseph Clemson]

8 hours ago, John Mitchell said:

 

By "this program seems to be aimed..." do you mean Shotcut or AVS?

AVS. Shotcut looks to be much more sophisticated than AVS but I found it not intuitive so I have no incentive to move from Davinci Resolve.

Edited August 12, 2021 by Joseph Clemson
Expanded answer

[MDM]

8 hours ago, John Mitchell said:

 

By "this program seems to be aimed..." do you mean Shotcut or AVS?

 

Aside from DaVinci Resolve which is an outlier in all of this given how fully featured it is, the free and cheap programs would all appear aimed at consumers at one level or another. Clearly what one needs in an app depends on what one wants to do. 

 

I took up video editing during the first wave of the pandemic and, as I couldn't do much else (not being able to go out and trying to recover from Covid), I dived in at the deep end. I learnt an awful lot over the last year and a half about just about all aspects of video post-processing using Final Cut Pro and Motion (Apple's answer to After Effects). I don't know what I am going to do with my new-found knowledge but it has been a really positive experience.

 

 

Edited August 12, 2021 by MDM

[Joseph Clemson]

15 minutes ago, MDM said:

 

Aside from DaVinci Resolve which is an outlier in all of this given how fully featured it is, the free and cheap programs would all appear aimed at consumers at one level or another. Clearly what one needs in an app depends on what one wants to do. 

 

I took up video editing during the first wave of the pandemic and, as I couldn't do much else (not being able to go out and trying to recover from Covid), I dived in at the deep end. I learnt an awful lot over the last year and a half about just about all aspects of video post-processing using Final Cut Pro and Motion (Apple's answer to After Effects). I don't know what I am going to do with my new-found knowledge but it has been a really positive experience.

 

 

 

In some respects you may have the advantage of me in coming to video now and learning from the current state of technology and software. You can see and incorporate the best and niftiest of what is new. I've been doing video for about fifteen years and much of my workflow has been set in semi-stone since I last reviewed my workflow when I got my Canon 60D and Resolve first came to my attention about seven years ago. I still work in HD (4K being a bridge too far financially). This thread has been most useful in prompting me to look seriously again at how I do things, so the discussion on various software and how others approach this is helpful. I'm feeling a bit like a half-blind dinosaur at the moment, but aiming to learn what I can and ernter a new period of video contribution leaner and fitter than I have been. 

[Vincent Lowe]

10 hours ago, Joseph Clemson said:

 

Hello Vincent, Thanks for pointing out this one. This program seems to be aimed at the consumer level, rather than someone aiming to edit files for profesional use. I haven't downloaded the program to try it out, but the screentour suggests features like the colour adjustment is done at a very simple level - no access to the separate colour channels, for example. I wouldn't write it off if someone is just looking to set out to learn a little about video editing, but not I'm so sure for what people here are likely to be working on.

 

I did download the AVS video convertor as I'm looking for a facility to convert my old collection of M2T files (from the Canon HV20) to DNxHD, for editing in Davinci Resolve. The AVS convertor can read the M2T files, but doesn't offer DNxHD or ProRes as export options. So, I'm still searching for a convertor which will do that job, if any one can help?

 

Thanks for the insight Joseph.  You are probably correct about 'consumer level' - I don't think my brother uses it for anything remotely 'professional'.  

 

For converting he's mentioned HandBrake (free, open source) - https://handbrake.fr/   Again, I've not used it myself.  The documentation says it will import DNxHD and ProRes files but I don't know about export options - https://handbrake.fr/docs/en/1.3.0/workflow/open-video-source.html

[Joseph Clemson]

35 minutes ago, Vincent Lowe said:

 

Thanks for the insight Joseph.  You are probably correct about 'consumer level' - I don't think my brother uses it for anything remotely 'professional'.  

 

For converting he's mentioned HandBrake (free, open source) - https://handbrake.fr/   Again, I've not used it myself.  The documentation says it will import DNxHD and ProRes files but I don't know about export options - https://handbrake.fr/docs/en/1.3.0/workflow/open-video-source.html

 

Sadly, no joy on the DNxHD export. It says Handbrake is designed to tbe the last stage in a video workflow so they only export to delivery codecs,, not those designed for professional editing. Thanks for trying. I'm tied up on other projects this week (not least my Fantasy Football teams!) so I'll have to continue my search for a suitable convertor in the coming days.

[Phil Robinson]

This thread has been interesting and useful. I'm sure I read the guidelines a few years ago when I started uploading video clips but I had forgotten about the minimal manipulation.
I've started doing a lot less, which of course is saving a lot of time.
I assume, like Alamy stills, sharpening is something to definitely be avoided?

 

As for 'consumer level' - all my equipment and software is consumer level (except maybe for a couple of lenses). 
Sub £1000 cameras, Photoshop Elements, Nikon ViewNX,...   I'm happy with it all so far.

 

Edited August 12, 2021 by Phil Robinson

[MDM]

3 hours ago, Joseph Clemson said:

 

In some respects you may have the advantage of me in coming to video now and learning from the current state of technology and software. You can see and incorporate the best and niftiest of what is new. I've been doing video for about fifteen years and much of my workflow has been set in semi-stone since I last reviewed my workflow when I got my Canon 60D and Resolve first came to my attention about seven years ago. I still work in HD (4K being a bridge too far financially). This thread has been most useful in prompting me to look seriously again at how I do things, so the discussion on various software and how others approach this is helpful. I'm feeling a bit like a half-blind dinosaur at the moment, but aiming to learn what I can and ernter a new period of video contribution leaner and fitter than I have been. 

 

Yes it is a time of huge transition in the world of video it seems. I came in just as Atomos, Apple and Nikon started pioneering ProRes Raw video at a price that was affordable in comparison to what it used to cost to shoot raw video. I already had a lot of what is needed so I dived in and, having come through the acute phase of Covid during the first wave, it gave me some real purpose in life when my wedding photography business had collapsed to zero. 

 

To say it has been a steep learning curve is a massive understatement. I am doing it purely for its own sake - if I ever make money out of it then great but that has not been the motive. I have been exploring all aspects of the video process - editing, grading, audio, special effects and so on. I have been really enjoying the whole learning process. 

 

This thread is inspiring me to have a go at stock so that is something to aim at now. 

[BobD]

39 minutes ago, MDM said:

 

Yes it is a time of huge transition in the world of video it seems. I came in just as Atomos, Apple and Nikon started pioneering ProRes Raw video at a price that was affordable in comparison to what it used to cost to shoot raw video. I already had a lot of what is needed so I dived in and, having come through the acute phase of Covid during the first wave, it gave me some real purpose in life when my wedding photography business had collapsed to zero. 

 

To say it has been a steep learning curve is a massive understatement. I am doing it purely for its own sake - if I ever make money out of it then great but that has not been the motive. I have been exploring all aspects of the video process - editing, grading, audio, special effects and so on. I have been really enjoying the whole learning process. 

 

This thread is inspiring me to have a go at stock so that is something to aim at now. 

 

Has the wedding business picked up yet? perhaps video is something you could offer in future.

[MDM]

14 hours ago, Joseph Clemson said:

I did download the AVS video convertor as I'm looking for a facility to convert my old collection of M2T files (from the Canon HV20) to DNxHD, for editing in Davinci Resolve. The AVS convertor can read the M2T files, but doesn't offer DNxHD or ProRes as export options. So, I'm still searching for a convertor which will do that job, if any one can help?

 

I might be misunderstanding the problem but can you not convert to something like MP4 and import that into DaVinci. You can then transcode it to ProRes in DaVinci. 

Edited August 12, 2021 by MDM

[MDM]

1 minute ago, BobD said:

 

Has the wedding business picked up yet? perhaps video is something you could offer in future.

 

I've got some coming up but not sure where I am going myself to be honest. I am still experiencing Long Covid and full day weddings are very arduous so I am thinking of how to work that (shorter packages?). I am also considering wedding video but I need to get a portfolio first. I hope I might get a chance to shoot some video at the upcoming weddings. 

[John Mitchell]

9 hours ago, Joseph Clemson said:

AVS. Shotcut looks to be much more sophisticated than AVS but I found it not intuitive so I have no incentive to move from Davinci Resolve.

 

I'm actually finding Shotcut quite easy to navigate. Mind you, I'm not doing anything complicated. I should take another look at Davinci.

 

BTW, I've been converting the MP4 files outputted by Shotcut to .mov before uploading to P5. Is this a good idea? Would it be better to submit as MP4?

 

As I said, this is all Martian to me at this point.

[MDM]

21 minutes ago, John Mitchell said:

 

I'm actually finding Shotcut quite easy to navigate. Mind you, I'm not doing anything complicated. I should take another look at Davinci.

 

BTW, I've been converting the MP4 files outputted by Shotcut to .mov before uploading to P5. Is this a good idea? Would it be better to submit as MP4?

 

As I said, this is all Martian to me at this point.

 As far as I know, MP4 is a highly compressed format in comparison to mov which has the potential to be higher quality and is a Mac format whereas MP4 is cross-platform.  Intuitively I think it would be pointless converting MP4 to mov after editing in the same way as you would not convert a JPEG to a TIFF after editing.  MP4 files tend to be a lot smaller than equivalent mov. 

Edited August 12, 2021 by MDM

[John Mitchell]

11 minutes ago, MDM said:

 As far as I know, MP4 is a highly compressed format in comparison to mov which has the potential to be higher quality and is a Mac format whereas MP4 is cross-platform.  Intuitively I think it would be pointless converting MP4 to mov after editing in the same way as you would not convert a JPEG to a TIFF after editing.  MP4 files tend to be a lot smaller than equivalent mov. 

 

So I should just submit in MP4?

 

Here is what P5 says:

 

"All videos should be prepared in MOV or MP4. If your footage is in a different format (such as AVI), please convert it to MOV or MP4 before uploading."

 

I get the feeling that they prefer .mov

 

 

Edited August 12, 2021 by John Mitchell