Rob Lavers Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 I am sorry I am probably not helping much. Just a thought, does your house insurance include a free legal advice service? It usually comes as a small extra. Or maybe a debt recovery agency based in S. Ireland, worth a call or enquiry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cryptoprocta Posted March 15, 2019 Author Share Posted March 15, 2019 14 minutes ago, Rob Lavers said: I am sorry I am probably not helping much. Just a thought, does your house insurance include a free legal advice service? It usually comes as a small extra. Or maybe a debt recovery agency based in S. Ireland, worth a call or enquiry. My house insurance legal service doesn't apply outwith the UK, and is fairly limited in scope. Remember, I've already had a meeting with an international IP lawyer. And that the abusing lawyer had also previously failed to respond to Alamy "several times". It looks as though a legal process, including a prejudgement, is necessary before the debt collectors can proceed. https://www.debtcollectionireland.net/choosing-debt-collectors-dublin-ireland Some I looked at required a signed contract with the debtor before they would even start discussing procedure. However, tomorrow I will get onto his ISP. The most ridiculous thing is he could just go a few steps out of his office and take a near-identical pic with his smartphone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Willis Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 5 hours ago, Cryptoprocta said: the clerkess claimed she "didn't know" about whether a website designer had designed the site, and wouldn't find out for me. I've just had a look at the page source for the lawyer's website (if you're using Chrome or Firefox as a browser, just right click on an empty bit of the homepage then click on 'View Page Source') and at the top of the code it says that the website has been built using Wix.com which would suggest that they've used a Wix template to create their website themselves. I realise that this won't be of any help in getting the lawyers to pay up, but Wix.com do have I section on their website that specifically deals with copyright infringement that states "Wix.com opposes all infringements of copyrights. As per our policy, we take action upon reports of alleged copyright infringement which comply with the requirements of the Digital Millennium Copyright Action (DMCA)" so they might at least be able to have your image taken down - https://www.wix.com/about/abuse Hope that helps a little. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrewP Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 7 hours ago, Cryptoprocta said: As I said in a previous post, the clerkess claimed she "didn't know" about whether a website designer had designed the site, and wouldn't find out for me. Looking at the page source data and searching for 'www' brings up some text for a person who is possibly the web designer: www.broofa.com mailto: robert@broofa.com. Copyright 2010 Robert Kieffer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacecadet Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 Only €25 to start a claim AFAICS. https://europa.eu/youreurope/business/dealing-with-customers/solving-disputes/european-small-claims-procedure/index_en.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cryptoprocta Posted March 15, 2019 Author Share Posted March 15, 2019 3 hours ago, spacecadet said: Only €25 to start a claim AFAICS. https://europa.eu/youreurope/business/dealing-with-customers/solving-disputes/european-small-claims-procedure/index_en.htm When I clicked through from that page, I got to this page: https://e-justice.europa.eu/content_small_claims-42-en.do which then said I had to click on the relevant country flag, which I still presume has to be Ireland, where the offender lives, not the UK, where I live. That took me to the page I linked to above, which has the limitations I quoted previously on the scope of their work: "Type of claims dealt with (a) a claim for goods or services bought for private use from someone selling them in the course of a business (consumer claims) (b) a claim for goods or services bought for business use from someone selling them in the course of a business (business claims) (c) a claim for minor damage to property (but excluding personal injuries) (d) a claim for the non-return of a rent deposit for certain kinds of rented properties. For example, a holiday home or a room / flat in a premises where the owner also lives provided that a claim does not exceed €2,000. Claims in respect of other matters relating to rented accommodation must be brought to: Residential Tenancies Board, P.O. Box 47, Clonakilty, Co. Cork. Website: http://www.rtb.ie/ Excluded from the small claims procedure are claims arising from: (a) a hire-purchase agreement (b) a breach of a leasing agreement (c) debt" So my order of action is now: 1. Contact the possible web designer Later: - decided that doesn't look very likely (doesn't seem to be a web designer/blog hasn't been updated since 2013): http://www.broofa.com Moved right on (reserving the right to re-visit) to: 2. Contact the ISP Hostopia (email has been sent) 3. Contact WIX 4. Contact media in his area Thanks, everybody for all your suggestions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacecadet Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 I think you're interpreting the guidance too tightly. You qualify under (b). Your service is the image licence, your customer is the defendant, he hasn't paid your invoice, so he owes you. The guidance isn't too helpful, but it must be possible for a business to sue another business for an unpaid bill. Under the European system you can raise a claim in your own jurisdiction or his- that's the point. If you start in Scotland, he can apply for it to be moved to Ireland, assuming he tries to defend, and you can object on the grounds of expense. My point was it doesn't cost a lot to start the process. Whether you think €25 or whatever the Scottish fee is for a licence of a few hunderd is up to you. The idea is he will pay up when he sees you're serious. If not, you have to decide whether to continue. But a solicitor with a court judgment against him may have trouble doing his job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cryptoprocta Posted March 15, 2019 Author Share Posted March 15, 2019 3 minutes ago, spacecadet said: I think you're interpreting the guidance too tightly. You qualify under (b). Your service is the image licence, your customer is the defendant, he hasn't paid your invoice, so he owes you. The guidance isn't too helpful, but it must be possible for a business to sue another business for an unpaid bill. OK, if I can't get it removed via hostopia or wix, I'll try the small claims procedure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cryptoprocta Posted March 15, 2019 Author Share Posted March 15, 2019 14 minutes ago, spacecadet said: Whether you think €25 or whatever the Scottish fee is for a licence of a few hunderd is up to you. The idea is he will pay up when he sees you're serious. If not, you have to decide whether to continue. But a solicitor with a court judgment against him may have trouble doing his job. I'd have to go through the Irish system. But isn't there also some way that they'd say, "The Alamy fee for this* use is £29.99 (that's what it shows as here, no idea what it is in Ireland), so how come you're charging hundreds? He's a lawyer and will know every nook and cranny of Irish law better than I do (i.e. 'nothing at all') In my original invoice, I said 50 Euros, to allow for bank fees. (* as an unreleased image, should he be using this photo on his business website, even if he'd paid for it? I pointed that out in my original registered letter.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacecadet Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 Then you're probably stuck with the €50 and it's hardly worth it. It would have been better to be non-committal on the fee (I've settled for £950 for commercial infringement of an image that was available on Alamy and which could have been licensed for the use for far less) but you are where you are. Just for reference, when costs are not awarded it's hardly worth a confessed infringer's while going to court just to argue about the fee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 18 hours ago, Cryptoprocta said: I don't mind at all. I will be very interested if you get any reply. So I sent each lawyer an email asking why they are using a stolen image on their website to promote their business. With links to their contact page and your photo on alamy. Signed off as a friend of Liz Layden. Funny enough, I got no reply. Personally I don't think it's worth pursuing your due royalties, but I think "name and shame" is the way to go. If anyone else wants to send them an email here is the address: info@kennysullivan.ie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cryptoprocta Posted March 15, 2019 Author Share Posted March 15, 2019 4 minutes ago, Tony said: So I sent each lawyer an email asking why they are using a stolen image on their website to promote their business. With links to their contact page and your photo on alamy. Signed off as a friend of Liz Layden. Funny enough, I got no reply. Personally I don't think it's worth pursuing your due royalties, but I think "name and shame" is the way to go. If anyone else wants to send them an email here is the address: info@kennysullivan.ie Thanks for feeding back! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 How about sending a line or two to their local newspaper, they might be interested? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cryptoprocta Posted March 15, 2019 Author Share Posted March 15, 2019 Just now, Tony said: How about sending a line or two to their local newspaper, they might be interested? Yup, that's on my list above after contacting the ISP and Wix. I may promote it to before Wix, since I've already emailled to the ISP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 That's the way to go, cause them as much trouble for their arrogance as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isphoto Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 "As I said in a previous post, the clerkess claimed she "didn't know" about whether a website designer had designed the site, and wouldn't find out for me". Before going to the press etc etc, send a letter to the MD/Lead partner of the legal firm (requesting a response within 14 days) and an invoice , outlining that they have breached your copyright. The "Clerkess" is likely too far down the food chain to be effective. If the law firm have commissioned an external web designer then it's for them to seek redress from the web designer, you are claiming payment from the law firm as they are the ones using your image commercially. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cryptoprocta Posted March 15, 2019 Author Share Posted March 15, 2019 12 minutes ago, isphoto said: "As I said in a previous post, the clerkess claimed she "didn't know" about whether a website designer had designed the site, and wouldn't find out for me". Before going to the press etc etc, send a letter to the MD/Lead partner of the legal firm (requesting a response within 14 days) and an invoice , outlining that they have breached your copyright. The "Clerkess" is likely too far down the food chain to be effective. If the law firm have commissioned an external web designer then it's for them to seek redress from the web designer, you are claiming payment from the law firm as they are the ones using your image commercially. As I've mentioned a few times above, the original registered letter was addressed to the lead lawyer with the invoice and a payment date. Obviously the clerkess opened it, that's her job. She said she had put it on his desk. I also attached the same letter and invoice in the email. When I phoned her after getting no reply to the email she said the email had gone to junk (but she hadn't checked it in a week!), and that she'd found it as I spoke to her, and she would print it out and put it on his desk. In the next phone call she said she had done that. Of course, she's too far down the chain, but as she is effectively a buffer zone, I can't get past her (without going in person, which would be far too expensive) - it may even be that 'her manager' had instructed her not to let me speak to him or his partners directly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starsphinx Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 Daft question but is there anyone on here in the area could maybe pay the office a visit? Or maybe the old fashioned telephone? I am not sure how price plans work with calls to Ireland but it can be surprisingly effective to phone every five minutes asking for the boss - it ties their phone line up and stops them doing any work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starsphinx Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 Oh and maybe https://www.independent.ie/regionals/braypeople/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrewP Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 2 hours ago, Cryptoprocta said: Of course, she's too far down the chain, but as she is effectively a buffer zone, I can't get past her What about phoning out of hours - 8am or 6pm. The lawyers may answer the phone themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cryptoprocta Posted March 15, 2019 Author Share Posted March 15, 2019 15 minutes ago, AndrewP said: What about phoning out of hours - 8am or 6pm. The lawyers may answer the phone themselves. I hadn't thought of that. I'll give it a go. I should have thought about it. On the third phone call when 'my manager is still in court', I said I know that lawyers will go into their offices after court to keep up on paperwork/other clients, and she didn't deny it. D'uh. Thanks for the suggestion! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 I have managed to find the personal email for Barry Kenny, therefore bypassing the clerk... bkenny@kennysullivan.ie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cryptoprocta Posted March 15, 2019 Author Share Posted March 15, 2019 I just phoned and a man answered. "Hello, is that Mr Kenney?" "Yes it is." "This is Elizabeth Leyden ..." He put down the phone immediately!!! (where the dots mean that I didn't get a chance to say anything else.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cryptoprocta Posted March 15, 2019 Author Share Posted March 15, 2019 32 minutes ago, Tony said: I have managed to find the personal email for Barry Kenny, therefore bypassing the clerk... bkenny@kennysullivan.ie Thanks, I'll try that, but I won't hold my breath!!! I've had nothing back from the ESP, not even an auto-reply. LATER: It took longer than I'd hoped but I found and updated my original covering letter and invoice and emailled Mr Kenny directly. I said that I'd just phoned him but "we seemed to be cut off". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starsphinx Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 It's starting to look like it will need a coordinated pressure effort. Let's see if there is a tourist board and chamber of commerce for Bray shall we? Maybe a few emails in that direction pointing out how blatant theft from professional photographers really is not a good look for the town. I did put a link to the local paper up - remind them that if something is true it cannot be libel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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