DavidC Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 A sale earlier this month increases my dislike for the licensing policy/policies: Country: United KingdomUsage: EditorialMedia: Magazine - Print onlyPrint run: up to 100,000Placement: InsideImage Size: 1 pageStart: 03 October 2013End: 03 November 2013Print, print and digital version, or standalone digital plus archive. UK, Worldwide and in Foreign Languages. Images can be sublicensed to international publishers and re-edited into bookazine format in the context of the original article use only. This is an extension of the syndication fiasco which allows newspapers to commercially arrange for the re-use of a story/picture page worldwide without any enhancement of the license fee. In this case the criteria governing the re-use seems further relaxed into bookazine (whatever that means) by virtue of a SUBLICENSE which appears to be granted in the terms.... If this agreement was achieved by our dear agency then who wrote that clause - and who insisted upon it - I hear the scritchy-scratchy claws of weasels at work....... ....and on that matter may I introduce their cousins - the stoats .........I have been asked to have my signature notarized on a settlement release agreement with an American infringer - the agreement was for only a couple of hundred dollars as it was a mildish theft - however, the cheapest stoat (sorry Notary) will charge me £80 plus VAT for a simple signature witness - the most expensive (but closer to me) wants £120 plus VAT - no wonder stoats wear ermine ! After tax and currency conversions it looks as if I would be paying all of the recovered funds directly to the stoat......... ...I know this is "Ask The Forum" - so what do you lot think - and are you happy - and is this commercially sensitive - and am I liable to be shot at dawn ? ......and for those obsessed with CTR mine was 1.53 for yesterday and I still see no relationship to sales and prices..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacecadet Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 The infringer should be paying your costs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Crean Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 The infringer should be paying your costs. 1000% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidC Posted October 25, 2013 Author Share Posted October 25, 2013 The infringer should be paying your costs. The agreement is written by weasels and specifically states that each party to pay their costs - come on Mark surely you expected that ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacecadet Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 It's not an agreement if you haven't signed it. Perhaps your own lawyer should have been involved in the drafting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidC Posted October 25, 2013 Author Share Posted October 25, 2013 It's not an agreement if you haven't signed it. Perhaps your own lawyer should have been involved in the drafting. Sorry should have called it 'release' - and he was. In USA a Notary Public would (in Texas) appear to have a charge of $6 for this service - in the UK minimum that I have found £80 plus VAT - that is why they glibly ask for notarization without realizing what a UK Notary would ask for. I'm sure that among our ranks we have someone whose real daytime job is as a weasel or stoat (no offense intended) who can explain why there is such a disparity in charges.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYCat Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 Wow. There are even notaries here in the US who will do it for free!! Maybe they have huge licensing fees there? More government oversight? Paulette Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacecadet Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 Perhaps because far fewer documents require them here. In some US states even wills have to be notarised, not just witnessed as they are here. Si the 'market' there is that much larger which presumably makes it a more routine and competitive product. i wonder why your lawyer didn't allow for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidC Posted October 25, 2013 Author Share Posted October 25, 2013 Wow. There are even notaries here in the US who will do it for free!! Maybe they have huge licensing fees there? More government oversight? Paulette Thanks Paulette, The point that I was trying to make was the absolute rip-off that we experience in the UK - this IS a like-for-like situation where the simple witnessing of a signature is required together with the simple checking of basic documents (i.e. driving license, utility bill). Mark, so it is supply and demand you think - not greed, and because they can ? My US lawyer was absolutely gobsmacked when I told him the fee required in the UK......don't understand what you mean by my lawyer allowing for it - each paying their costs is pretty standard in a Settlement Release Agreement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacecadet Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 US notaries don't have to be lawyers, so they can set up in business with very little experience, training or outlay. All they need is a state licence. In California the training course takes precisely six hours.A bit like photography, where someone can licence off SS for £1 of Getty for £100 for images which do essentially the same job.Here they're legally qualified. We have no separate unskilled category.We have our professional standards and there's no reason why another profession shouldn't have its own. Presumably you would have a minimum price for a piece of work, and I'm sure it would be nearer the £80 than the $6. It's not worth typing a letter for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidC Posted October 25, 2013 Author Share Posted October 25, 2013 US notaries don't have to be lawyers, so they can set up in business with very little experience, training or outlay. All they need is a state licence. In California the training course takes precisely six hours. A bit like photography, where someone can licence off SS for £1 of Getty for £100 for images which do essentially the same job. Here they're legally qualified. We have no separate unskilled category. We have our professional standards and there's no reason why another profession shouldn't have its own. Once registered, how much time, experience and skill do you require to check two or three documents, countersign and stamp - sorry Mark - the job is the same, and as you know the photocopying and paper shuffling would be done by the secretary not the Notary - and as an aside I am not aware of a list of 'professional standards' universally applied to photographers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidC Posted October 25, 2013 Author Share Posted October 25, 2013 US notaries don't have to be lawyers, so they can set up in business with very little experience, training or outlay. All they need is a state licence. In California the training course takes precisely six hours. A bit like photography, where someone can licence off SS for £1 of Getty for £100 for images which do essentially the same job. Here they're legally qualified. We have no separate unskilled category. We have our professional standards and there's no reason why another profession shouldn't have its own. Presumably you would have a minimum price for a piece of work, and I'm sure it would be nearer the £80 than the $6. It's not worth typing a letter for that. It'll get confusing if you keep popping back a couple of posting and re-editing........but your last line above says it all - have you sold an image under the scheming newspapers arrangement - $6 is about what you'll get ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacecadet Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 Well you know what you'd consider professional conduct, surely. Ours aren't mandatory, lawyers' are, and they have spent time and money conforming to them. That expertise is reflected in their fees, and of course the secretary has to be paid. One could say that once you've acquired the photographic equipment, computers, etc, kept them up to date, bought insurance, paid for a vehicle, and the years of experience, then it doesn't take you very long to take a photograph. But you're charging for all the other stuff as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Morrison Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 I'm starting a course, retraining stock photographers to be lawyers. Any takers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linda Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 David, Over here I have my bank do the notary signings.It's free if you have an account. Also,currency exchanges provide this as well for a couple of dollars over here. I would NOT settle unless they pay it. That's me though. My copyrights are registered way in advance of most infringements I find so I am willing to fight tooth and nail for the value of an image. I'm totally sick of being ripped off and then having the infringers think they can dictate the terms! In my world,it doesn't work that way! :-)L Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ann Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 Where I am there are local business people who notarize signature for free, as neighborly gesture.... Perhaps the party who drew up the agreement thought your notary cost would be more like that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidC Posted October 26, 2013 Author Share Posted October 26, 2013 The UK Notaries are usually fully qualified solicitors who have spent an additional four years to qualify as Notaries it seems - their fees reflect this in no uncertain manner - here the 'witness' of a signature can be done by a wide variety of people including ordinary solicitors, bank managers, even next door neighbours ! - it is yet another case of the anglo/american divide where the language meanings are often different. Your lot ask for a signature to be notarized - when witnessed would probably do - our Notaries think that a fee between £80-£120 is a reasonable recompense for looking at a passport/driving license/utility bill and countersigning a document plus a stamp. .......and thanks John I don't want to join your law school - and this topic really was about the policy of allowing customers to syndicate and even sublicense an image - we've weaseled away from that quite efectively ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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