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Failed submissions - non-discrimination

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2 hours ago, tarsierspectral said:

what is this? kindergarten? 

 

Nope, it's the White House. :D

 

I always thought that the old 30-day ban was excessive, but a 10-day one doesn't sound too bad to me. It gives a new contributor about the right amount of down time to figure out the problem(s), to consult with others on the forum as David is doing, and to regroup.

Edited by John Mitchell
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Yes thank you I have ordered Lightroom 6 and I already have the Photoshop and complete Lightroom suite on my PC. Very grateful for you advice.

 

I have a few more simple questions as there does not seem to be a help guide written by Alamy on these aspects:

 

(1) Is it possible to change the file name of the uploaded image after it has been approved by QC and is up for sale. For example. I have put 'Pembrey' when I meant 'Pembury'.

Or - do you have to delete the image from your collection and then send it back up for re-approval? with an amended file name?

 

(2) Is it possible to delete the image on sale and replace it with an identical shot but which has been for example corrected in Lightroom? Or do you have to delete the whole thing and start again?

 

(3) Is it possible to show Alamy QC an image - say of a naturally coloured but exceptionally interesting plant - but which you have re-coloured in Photoshop in five different shades - so that you don't lose 50 shots and hours of uploading time because they were never going to approve the images in the first place?  It would be good if you could place an image in a holding slot for approval of a whole class of photos - with a yes/no button from QC. 

 

(4) Does it make sense to upload the same image twice but with completely different title and tags in order to double the opportunities for sales - or is that frowned upon? For example - a reed mace (bulrush) setting seeds into the wind against a blue sky could be titled and tagged as plant botany, ecology etc - but also in a separate upload as philosophy, religion hope, mystery etc.

 

Thanks again

 

David

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9 hours ago, tarsierspectral said:

what is this? kindergarten? 

 

No, it's obviously not.  But that's how Alamy is treating it...

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1 hour ago, Darkstar said:

Yes thank you I have ordered Lightroom 6 and I already have the Photoshop and complete Lightroom suite on my PC. Very grateful for you advice.

 

I have a few more simple questions as there does not seem to be a help guide written by Alamy on these aspects:

 

(1) Is it possible to change the file name of the uploaded image after it has been approved by QC and is up for sale. For example. I have put 'Pembrey' when I meant 'Pembury'.

Or - do you have to delete the image from your collection and then send it back up for re-approval? with an amended file name?

 

(2) Is it possible to delete the image on sale and replace it with an identical shot but which has been for example corrected in Lightroom? Or do you have to delete the whole thing and start again?

 

(3) Is it possible to show Alamy QC an image - say of a naturally coloured but exceptionally interesting plant - but which you have re-coloured in Photoshop in five different shades - so that you don't lose 50 shots and hours of uploading time because they were never going to approve the images in the first place?  It would be good if you could place an image in a holding slot for approval of a whole class of photos - with a yes/no button from QC. 

 

(4) Does it make sense to upload the same image twice but with completely different title and tags in order to double the opportunities for sales - or is that frowned upon? For example - a reed mace (bulrush) setting seeds into the wind against a blue sky could be titled and tagged as plant botany, ecology etc - but also in a separate upload as philosophy, religion hope, mystery etc.

 

Thanks again

 

David

 

1) File name doesn't matter, only captions and tags are important.

 

2) You can delete any image you want to but it takes 180 days to disappear off the system.

 

3) No.  Submitting the same image 5 times but in different colours would be classed as too many similars.

 

4) No.  You can add all the keywords to the same image, they'll still be searchable under the 'plant botany' and 'philosophy' subjects.

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1 hour ago, Darkstar said:

Yes thank you I have ordered Lightroom 6 and I already have the Photoshop and complete Lightroom suite on my PC. Very grateful for you advice.

 

 

 

I take it you mean you ordered the book not Lightroom 6 itself.

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Somebody is slinging red arrows around in here. I wonder who? How silly. One could say kindergartenlike. I don't give red arrows. I just do rational arguments/debates/discussions.

 

I got a red arrow for the following: "He hasn't been "banned" for the type of camera he used, he has been penalised for multiple QC failures (read back this thread), one of which is  Digital camera not suitable for Alamy. He has also failed due to SoLD and over-manuipulation (I'm presuming) according to his earlier posts. A 10 day penalty is not such a bad thing if somebody is serious about submitting to Alamy -  it should help tt focus the mind among other things. It is clear from this and another thread about JPEG sizes that the OP is not entirely knowledgeable about various aspects of the technical side of digital photography so it is perhaps not surprising that he is failing. Hopefully he will learn by his mistakes - always a great way to learn when they are not fatal. "

 

 

Edited by MDM

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Ha! Yes I ordered the book - I already have the latest Lightroom and Photoshop suite with regular updates from Adobe. It is my fault I did not use Lightroom and now that you are all encouraging me to take a much more professional approach then I will be studying all this very hard and trying to catch up with you all. I must say once more that I do find you a very supportive group.

Edited by Darkstar

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1 minute ago, Darkstar said:

Ha! Yes I ordered the book - I already have the latest Lightroom and Photoshop suite with regular updates from Adobe. It is my fault we not using Lightroom and now that you are all encouraging me to take a much more professional approach then I will be studying all this very hard and trying to catch up with you all. I must say once more that I do find you a very supportive group.

 

Great. If you take all that in you wll be an expert in no time.

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19 minutes ago, Colblimp said:

 

No, it's obviously not.  But that's how Alamy is treating it...

 

Alamy is the only agency I know that validates photos in less than 24 hours, which can probably only be done by trusting the quality of contributors' photos. When successive problems are detected I find it normal to take a moment to correct what is wrong. In any case, in quite a few agencies the validation period is several days, so 10 days ban are not very different from the normal acceptation period elsewhere...

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1 minute ago, Southmind said:

 

Alamy is the only agency I know that validates photos in less than 24 hours, which can probably only be done by trusting the quality of contributors' photos. When successive problems are detected I find it normal to take a moment to correct what is wrong. In any case, in quite a few agencies the validation period is several days, so 10 days ban are not very different from the normal acceptation period elsewhere...

 

Yes I'm okay about it - it's been a learning curve and I agree that Alamy are quick. I think the pain for me and for some others has been that if you spend Saturday and Sunday laboriously uploading 76 photos only to find that your whole stack has been a waste of time and you still don't know if the other 75 will be accepted...

 

So I will be much more careful and hope not to suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous... again!

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12 minutes ago, Darkstar said:

 

Yes I'm okay about it - it's been a learning curve and I agree that Alamy are quick. I think the pain for me and for some others has been that if you spend Saturday and Sunday laboriously uploading 76 photos only to find that your whole stack has been a waste of time and you still don't know if the other 75 will be accepted...

 

So I will be much more careful and hope not to suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous... again!

 

I understand ... That's why I rarely submit more than a dozen photos at a time.

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I fully support Alamy's QC process and with that also the bans connected.

The QC requirements are clear and I would also say sufficiently  impartial and objective. 

This also makes me  checking  my pictures thoroughly and in  detail prior to submission. 

Most certainly I am over-critical; some pictures landing in the bin that probably do not deserve this. 

 

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11 hours ago, gardenbush said:

I agree with Colblimp - banning to me seems archaic and fulfills nothing...as there is a qc process, all images that do not meet the criteria should be rejected...but to be put on the 'naughty step'? Silly I think and Alamy misses out on potential future sales during the banning period...

 

Bans are issued for repeated failures. It costs Alamy time and money to QC images so if you've demonstrated more than once that you're not capable of meeting the standards, why should they just go on paying QC controllers to reject duds without any incentives for you to improve? And if you can't meet the standards, just how many potential sales do you think they're missing out on?

 

Alan

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11 hours ago, gardenbush said:

I agree with Colblimp - banning to me seems archaic and fulfills nothing...as there is a qc process, all images that do not meet the criteria should be rejected...but to be put on the 'naughty step'? Silly I think and Alamy misses out on potential future sales during the banning period...

...and the policy has not changed. Railing against it gets you nowhere.

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5 hours ago, Darkstar said:

 

Yes I'm okay about it - it's been a learning curve and I agree that Alamy are quick. I think the pain for me and for some others has been that if you spend Saturday and Sunday laboriously uploading 76 photos only to find that your whole stack has been a waste of time and you still don't know if the other 75 will be accepted...

 

So I will be much more careful and hope not to suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous... again!

But if you submit high quality images you don't have to wonder whether they will be accepted or not.  I'm not sure how much clearer this can be.  There is nothing mysterious about this.  Very straight forward process.

Edited by tarsierspectral

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6 hours ago, Colblimp said:

 

No, it's obviously not.  But that's how Alamy is treating it...

No, they are not.  You on the other hand, want them to waste time on babysitting incompetent people rather than focusing on selling photos.  This is a professional market.  If one can't tell a blurry photo apart from a correctly focused one, then perhaps they should go and learn first.  Maybe people will realize that snapping photos and making money is not as easy as everyone makes it sound.  You need to be skilled in your craft.

Edited by tarsierspectral
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4 hours ago, tarsierspectral said:

No, they are not.  You on the other hand, want them to waste time on babysitting incompetent people rather than focusing on selling photos.  This is a professional market.  If one can't tell a blurry photo apart from a correctly focused one, then perhaps they should go and learn first.  Maybe people will realize that snapping photos and making money is not as easy as everyone makes it sound.  You need to be skilled in your craft.

 

Woah, steady on big boy!  No need to be so aggressive and insulting!  Nobody on here is incompetent, and I really hope you're not referring to me in your comment!

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45 minutes ago, Colblimp said:

 

Woah, steady on big boy!  No need to be so aggressive and insulting!  Nobody on here is incompetent, and I really hope you're not referring to me in your comment!

 

21 hours ago, Colblimp said:

I don't care what David was banned for, he shouldn't have been banned at all!  Banning a new contributor isn't going to make them feel very welcome, is it now?!  If I'd had QC failures in my early days and had been banned, I would have told Alamy to f**k off and not bothered any more.  So what if he's had a few QC failures, is banning him going to help?  Of course not!!! :angry:

 

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Flaming and trolling may not be a solution here. 

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I am sorry that there is some discord and thanks for all your support. I may not be as good at the technical aspects of photography as some colleagues here - however, I have been praised by Sussex Wildlife Trust, the police, and our local MP. I have done some photography for Hastings Tourist Board which was preferred to that of David Bailey - and also I have a massive print of one of my Mamiya 6x7s as the permanent backdrop to parliamentary elections whenever the General Election results are read out. So I do feel I am getting somewhere with photography as art. Now I am going to study Lightroom and then I hope gradually to be even more successful. I have photographed a large part of the world from the Falklands and Ascension Island, to Greenland and Svalbard and the Dufourspitze summit of Monte Rosa and in many places in Italy, Greece, Cyprus, Morocco, Hong Kong, China and Labrador. I have been to Baalbek and Tannourine and slept overnight in the Bekaa Valley and on the Okstind Icecap - and I'm proud to have managed to get inside the Al Khiam South Lebanese Army Torture Centre and take some shots before the Israelis bombed it. I have photographed turtles being born on Masirah Island off the coast of Oman. Scientists have told me that some of my insect photographs have helped them to understand Roesel's Cricket far better because of the clarity of my macro work. I do love photography like you all do and I accept that I must work the way that you all work, now I understand the system. Sorry to cause such a kerfuffle! I am sure this will make me a better photographer.

 

Thanks again.

 

David

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The object here is what others have stated. It’s a professional market. Alamy have posted what’s required, and let members know what’s unacceptable. 

One must, as a new contributor, read everything that’s been made available so he/she understands the policies.

I would think if one’s feelings are so easily injured by having images rejected, one might not have the fortitude for the long run in this business.

As far as being a newbie...should they be above the rules that everyone else must live by? I think a 10 day ban would help a newbie understand how important it is for he/she to do their own QC early on.  If you let a newbie skate on the ban, he/she will just keep on uploading that occasional bad image along with their good ones.

Some of those might not be caught by QC and Alamy’s credibility with buyers would suffer.

My first ever submission was rejected. This was back in the day when I had to send the images on a CD from the U.S. to the UK. What a pain!  I most certainly didn’t like the failure, but I can tell you this much, I did everything I could to understand the why. Did I feel a bit insulted sometimes? You bet your booties. But I sucked it up and persevered. I learned that feeling insulted was my fault. You can let those feelings take over your life...or not. These days, I choose NOT.

 

I’ve had more failures through the years. Sometimes it was because I got in a hurry, was tired, and failed to inspect at 100%. Then I guess I had a bad copy of the D7000, because I had more failures with that camera for soft and lacking definition than any other. 

My eyesight wasn’t what it should be. None of these are excuses because most of the failures were my fault. I changed cameras. Fixed my eyesight problem.  Began tossing any image I felt was 50-50 on whether it was sharp enough, even the ones I felt were special.

 

 If QC fails me, I’ve learned to not take it personal. They don’t hate me. They don’t hate my images. They aren’t persecuting me.  I’m not the only one they’re failing that day.

Betty

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57 minutes ago, Darkstar said:

I am sorry that there is some discord and thanks for all your support. I may not be as good at the technical aspects of photography as some colleagues here - however, I have been praised by Sussex Wildlife Trust, the police, and our local MP. I have done some photography for Hastings Tourist Board which was preferred to that of David Bailey - and also I have a massive print of one of my Mamiya 6x7s as the permanent backdrop to parliamentary elections whenever the General Election results are read out. So I do feel I am getting somewhere with photography as art. Now I am going to study Lightroom and then I hope gradually to be even more successful. I have photographed a large part of the world from the Falklands and Ascension Island, to Greenland and Svalbard and the Dufourspitze summit of Monte Rosa and in many places in Italy, Greece, Cyprus, Morocco, Hong Kong, China and Labrador. I have been to Baalbek and Tannourine and slept overnight in the Bekaa Valley and on the Okstind Icecap - and I'm proud to have managed to get inside the Al Khiam South Lebanese Army Torture Centre and take some shots before the Israelis bombed it. I have photographed turtles being born on Masirah Island off the coast of Oman. Scientists have told me that some of my insect photographs have helped them to understand Roesel's Cricket far better because of the clarity of my macro work. I do love photography like you all do and I accept that I must work the way that you all work, now I understand the system. Sorry to cause such a kerfuffle! I am sure this will make me a better photographer.

 

Thanks again.

 

David

 

Congratulations on being able to go so many fascinating places. I was intrigued and started looking at your photos. Cute koalas! But I looked at the keywords and was appalled. A koala is not an eagle or a tiger. No sense working to get photos past QC if you are going to do a poor job of keywording. You seem very willing to get to work. I would suggest starting with your captions and keywords. Alamy offers lots of advice. Good luck with it.

 

Paulette

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34 minutes ago, NYCat said:

 

Congratulations on being able to go so many fascinating places. I was intrigued and started looking at your photos. Cute koalas! But I looked at the keywords and was appalled. A koala is not an eagle or a tiger. No sense working to get photos past QC if you are going to do a poor job of keywording. You seem very willing to get to work. I would suggest starting with your captions and keywords. Alamy offers lots of advice. Good luck with it.

 

Paulette

I agree. There is a red beaked bird on a nest, KG3FP2 that simply has Wildlife on xxxxxx island.

No place in the keywords is this bird identified with common name or scientific name. But there are keywords, seal, sea lion, penguin, pelican colony.

YIKES!  The image will never be sold because it can’t be found by its proper name. It doesn’t even have the tag, “bird”. But it will get a lot of views for the wrong animals listed, virtually ruining CTR. Eventually the image will sink to the back pages. 

David, did you group tag all of the images from the same shoot? 

You can group tag words like the place, but you must individually tag each animal. Only use words that fit the image. If you have an image of a bird, you must identify the bird by common and scientific names. If a seal isn’t in the image, that keyword should never be used.

You’ll need to fix captions and tags as Paulette said.

You have beautiful images. Your tags and captions doom them.

Betty

Edited by Betty LaRue

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It's always nice to know where the current limits are. Not just for Darkstar, which by all means is a newbie only at posting here, but also for some of the others here, including myself.

In his case it's an iffy camera; in some cases it's iffy pp or iffy ISO or iffy whatever. Usually it's one of those babies one hates to kill bin.

So it's really helpful to show not only images that have gotten through, but also ones that have not.

For gotten through, I obviously do not mean sneaked in with a bunch of others.

 

wim

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HI again

 

Yes you have once more identified things I could do to improve - all good advice. My original strategy was to get 500 fully searchable shots online to have some sort of presence and then refine them as you are suggesting. Some of my shots do have the animal and Latin classification name and others I still have to do. I will work through them over time.

 

I have been lucky to travel all over the shop as you say, but my Achilles Heel has been the cameras. The Sony is unacceptable to Alamy, the Canon is a little better and the Nikon is fine. The Mamiya 6x7 is 'slides only' so even if I had each of them scanned, Alamy would not accept them presumably because the Mamiya is a non-DLSR medium format camera and the pixels would therefore be artificially generated by a line scanner?

 

I do have an electronic slide scanner and thousands of slides - for example the Oman stuff is all Kodak slides from a non-digital camera (Yashica) but Alamy proscription would make them upload non grata!

 

Anecdote:

 

I do have one awful claim to fame. I ran a print and packshot studio for commercial leaflets, posters for several years with umbrella lights and a PMT camera for knock-downs. I used AppleMacs and Quark Xpress and did national exhibition typesetting demos for Apple. I was one of the first people in UK to have a laser printer (it cost me £4,400 at the time!!!)  I also did some portrait work (Bay City Rollers (ha!). A man came into the studio and explained that he had developed a special disposal garment for NHS surgeons - head to toe cover - and that the Americans were interested too. Could I please do the packshots for him so that he could show them to the Americans. I did all the work, he paid me. Then I read that he had been found murdered face down in a swamp in Florida! He had been conned by gangsters big time.

 

How about all of you - do you have any dodgy (but true) stories  like that?

 

cheers and all the best

 

David

 

 

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