Betty LaRue

Have you done your legacy images?

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1 hour ago, Doc said:

Indeed - I too have found this - so the only thing I am doing to my legacy images (if I do anything at all) is make the supertags up to 10 by adding 3 or 4 phrases, but not changing the order of the supertags or anything else!

 

Kumar (the Doc one)

Thanks Kumar,  I was beginning to think it was just me.  Perhaps those reporting better results/sales etc didn't have good placement in the first instance whereas my images are often near the front.

 

Pearl

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My images from past few years are placed high, and I get a lot of zooms. A huge number on the first page.  I plan on checking some of my oldest images that I have fixed and see where they are.

Actually, my placement improvement may have as much to do with caption repair as what I've done with keywords.  I didn't realize the caption was searchable back when and seldom put the location in the caption.

I'll let you know re: old stuff.

Betty

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I tested nine images dating back from 2009 to 11. One wasn't on the first 3 pages, I didn't go deeper. One was on the second page.

All the rest were on the first page, several at #1. Like one that was #1, #4, and #7, first page.

 

I'll keep on doing what I'm doing.

Betty

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26 minutes ago, Betty LaRue said:

I tested nine images dating back from 2009 to 11. One wasn't on the first 3 pages, I didn't go deeper. One was on the second page.

All the rest were on the first page, several at #1. Like one that was #1, #4, and #7, first page.

 

I'll keep on doing what I'm doing.

Betty

But how many pages altogether in the search you did Betty?  I am just finding that for a given search, those that have been done are generally behind those that haven't.  One image in particular was nowhere to be seen and I gave up at page 100 whereas it had been on page 1.

 

Pearl

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26 minutes ago, Betty LaRue said:

I tested nine images dating back from 2009 to 11. One wasn't on the first 3 pages, I didn't go deeper. One was on the second page.

All the rest were on the first page, several at #1. Like one that was #1, #4, and #7, first page.

 

I'll keep on doing what I'm doing.

Betty

 

I'm starting to see some of the old images that I've reworked move up in search results. Whether or not this will result in more sales remains to be seen. However, I plan to keep on meandering through my collection when the urge strikes, tinkering as I go.

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Trying to look at the big picture can anyone see how all this activity is improving the search experience for buyers?

 

It strikes me that really all that  is happening is that contributors have been offered a way to improve the search positions of their own images compared with the previous system which was more based on customer activity. 

 

How is this a better system overall, rather than from the perspective of the individual contributor?

 

To put it crudely if your images ( and mine!) were where they were out of merit based on customer activity and sales then being able to elevate them though doing busy work that others won't do seems a strange, actually contradictory, way to improve things for the buyer.

 

 

Edited by geogphotos

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Pearl, the images I chose weren't subjects with only a few pages of results. I'm sorry, but I didn't pay that much attention to that. Just know there were quite a few pages.

And, Geoff, if I had as many images as you do, I might have the same opinion.  But we of relatively small ports need some way not to be buried behind you of huge ports. 

All I can say is that my zooms are very healthy, so I would assume that my highly placed images are of interest to buyers. And, while I'm not selling a lot, even so, August sales were nearly double of July's. My sales are pretty much following the formula of one sale per 1000. Sometimes less, sometimes more. And that gets harder and harder to maintain considering how bloated the total image count of Alamy is getting. Way more competition than when I joined. I'm not prolific, so I'm constantly losing ground.

 

That said, we all who don't have large ports have good months and bad months, that's the nature of it, and has always been so. 

 

Pearl, you strike me as a very competent processor, so I doubt that you failed to have good captions like I did and do. I'm good recently, but like I said before, I failed captions miserably for years. Fixing those probably plays somewhat into my success with my reworked images. 

Hard to say. I do know I'm adding phrases to quite a few of the oldies.

Those of you who have done it right from the beginning might not see the improvement I'm seeing. Hard to improve on near perfection. 

I added a lot of quotes to my tags at one time. Those didn't translate well. A mess. I'm having to delete those tag phrases and add them again.

and I'm finding long strings of what should be single tags lumped together into one. Fixing those messes has to help.

Betty

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5 hours ago, geogphotos said:

Trying to look at the big picture can anyone see how all this activity is improving the search experience for buyers?

 

It strikes me that really all that  is happening is that contributors have been offered a way to improve the search positions of their own images compared with the previous system which was more based on customer activity. 

 

How is this a better system overall, rather than from the perspective of the individual contributor?

 

To put it crudely if your images ( and mine!) were where they were out of merit based on customer activity and sales then being able to elevate them though doing busy work that others won't do seems a strange, actually contradictory, way to improve things for the buyer.

 

 

 

Did buyers actually ask for an improved search experience, I wonder (?).

 

It seems to me that rank and sales still count a lot more than any minor changes that might come about through busy work -- i.e. reworking tags probably won't be of much help to contributors who have a low rank and few sales.

 

 

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I don't know what to do re: 'legacy' images.  I'm so new that none of my pics can really be called 'legacy'!  I guess doing my port now whilst it's still so small is the thing to do.

 

Re: Phillipe, my goodness, isn't he missed?!  I can absolutely understand why he felt the need to leave as certain people on here seem to be cantankerous, which there's absolutely no need for - manners cost nothing and it's nice to be nice!  Anyway, I wish Phillipe would come back!

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6 hours ago, John Mitchell said:

 

Did buyers actually ask for an improved search experience, I wonder (?).

 

 

 

 

 

Yes, it would help to know what was 'broken', or at least what the goal is. I can see that from an individual perspective that there are tools available to tag work and gain an advantage knowing that others won't. But I can't see the overall gain from that process.

 

Not sure how this AIM change increases Alamy and contributor revenue and would like to see some initiatives more focused on that purpose.

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12 hours ago, Betty LaRue said:

Pearl, you strike me as a very competent processor, so I doubt that you failed to have good captions like I did and do. I'm good recently, but like I said before, I failed captions miserably for years. Fixing those probably plays somewhat into my success with my reworked images. 

Hard to say. I do know I'm adding phrases to quite a few of the oldies.

Those of you who have done it right from the beginning might not see the improvement I'm seeing. Hard to improve on near perfection. 

I added a lot of quotes to my tags at one time. Those didn't translate well. A mess. I'm having to delete those tag phrases and add them again.

and I'm finding long strings of what should be single tags lumped together into one. Fixing those messes has to help.

Betty

I have always put fairly comprehensive captions on my images including location where that mattered so I am now only adding a bit more info with the extra characters that we have.  

What distresses me particularly is that the image I am referring to that is now on page >100 has sold a couple of times for reasonable prices.  It is not a true legacy image as it was shot last summer but was keyworded in the old system. Now it is so far out of sight that I doubt it will sell again unless for a very specific search.

I should add that the tests I have been doing that had such bad outcomes were single word searches.  Double of multi-word searches give much better results but not necessarily better than before.

 

Pearl

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8 hours ago, geogphotos said:

 

Yes, it would help to know what was 'broken', or at least what the goal is. I can see that from an individual perspective that there are tools available to tag work and gain an advantage knowing that others won't. But I can't see the overall gain from that process.

 

Not sure how this AIM change increases Alamy and contributor revenue and would like to see some initiatives more focused on that purpose.

You are missing the point as far as I'm concerned.

Read my lips...:D

My legacy images did not transition well in the new AIM.  Many broken tags with a single end letter missing from a tag and the single letter in a tag box all by itself.  How would you feel about a tag "bird" ending up "bir" "d"?  Every phrase where I used quotes completely shattered. Long strings of what should be single tags clumped together in one tag box.

I'm just trying to get my tags back to the searchable experience they had before the transition. I'm not gaming the system. I'm just doing the work to restore them to what they used to be.  That has no impact for the buyer experience, other than they can find my fixed images now with a keyword search that is as it once was instead of broken.

As far as gaining an advantage over those who don't do the work? Who knows....some say their images slipped after doing the work. And if I want to do the work and others don't, that's not my fault. My good or bad, your good or bad.

I can only control my portfolio, I can't control yours.  I doubt my paltry port and sales will impact yours. If I had your numbers, Geoff, and I did the work and you didn't, that might change a bit. Not that much, though, because few images of my subject matter would be in your port to compete with. Only if you traveled to the U.S. And shot the subjects I shoot.

Betty

Edited by Betty LaRue
Typo

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37 minutes ago, Betty LaRue said:

You are missing the point as far as I'm concerned.

Read my lips...:D

My legacy images did not transition well in the new AIM.  Many broken tags with a single end letter missing from a tag and the single letter in a tag box all by itself.  How would you feel about a tag "bird" ending up "bir" "d"?  Every phrase where I used quotes completely shattered. Long strings of what should be single tags clumped together in one tag box.

I'm just trying to get my tags back to the searchable experience they had before the transition. I'm not gaming the system. I'm just doing the work to restore them to what they used to be.  That has no impact for the buyer experience, other than they can find my fixed images now with a keyword search that is as it once was instead of broken.

As far as gaining an advantage over those who don't do the work? Who knows....some say their images slipped after doing the work. And if I want to do the work and others don't, that's not my fault. My good or bad, your good or bad.

I can only control my portfolio, I can't control yours.  I doubt my paltry port and sales will impact yours. If I had your numbers, Geoff, and I did the work and you didn't, that might change a bit. Not that much, though, because few images of my subject matter would be in your port to compete with. Only if you traveled to the U.S. And shot the subjects I shoot.

Betty

 

No I don't think I am missing any point. I questioned the overall purpose of the new AIM system and what it is trying to achieve. What was the problem that it is trying to solve?

 

I did not say anything about individuals apart from how I could see that an individual could benefit from doing the tagging work.

 

Good for you if you can see a way to make the new system work for you but that was not what I was trying to discuss.

 

 

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It seems to me that the new AIM was mainly an attempt to "modernize" the system. It did address some of the issues that contributors had with the old system, but it has also created new ones. That's always the case, though, which is why  I never "upgrade" anything until I absolutely have to. B)

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45 minutes ago, GS-Images said:

 

*Cough*

 

I know you can't help thinking about me, and I don't blame you - Who wouldn't constantly think about someone who likes cows? It's perfectly natural. However, on this occasion, it caused you to use my rather splendid name in place of Ian. Your punishment is that you aren't allowed to visit my cows for a week.

 

Oh and if you get it right, changing tags is very beneficial. I'm very happy that most don't bother because I know I get a big advantage, and to be honest I've had enough of explaining why it works for some and not others, but it falls on deaf ears.

 

Geoff.

Lol, yes, I must've had you on my mind! That's because of your winning personality and all of those beautiful cows! Although I must admit a little lingering resentment after one cow bucked me off when I was eight. Thank heavens for my stepfather who rescued me mid-air.

Never, never substitute a cow for a longed-for horse. Besides the fact that cows have bony backs.

Betty

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I can see that from an individual perspective that there are tools available to tag work and gain an advantage knowing that others won't. But I can't see the overall gain from that process.

 

Sorry, but that reads like you think I'm doing the work to gain an advantage when all I'm doing is restoring the images searchability to what they once had. That is my overall gain.

I rest my case. -_-

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27 minutes ago, Betty LaRue said:

I can see that from an individual perspective that there are tools available to tag work and gain an advantage knowing that others won't. But I can't see the overall gain from that process.

 

Sorry, but that reads like you think I'm doing the work to gain an advantage when all I'm doing is restoring the images searchability to what they once had. That is my overall gain.

I rest my case. -_-

 

I too see it as house-cleaning. My little office needs dusting and vacuuming as well. I tend to procrastinate...

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29 minutes ago, Betty LaRue said:

I can see that from an individual perspective that there are tools available to tag work and gain an advantage knowing that others won't. But I can't see the overall gain from that process.

 

Sorry, but that reads like you think I'm doing the work to gain an advantage when all I'm doing is restoring the images searchability to what they once had. That is my overall gain.

I rest my case. -_-

 

Betty, I am not talking about you specifically or individually.

 

I am making a general point about Alamy and all of its contributors.

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42 minutes ago, Betty LaRue said:

Maybe it just seemed that way since this was my thread. :)

 

Okay. I'll remember not to comment on your threads in the future.

 

 

 

 

Edited by geogphotos
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On 9/3/2017 at 22:41, Betty LaRue said:

I'm not so organized myself, John. But better at that than having technical knowledge. I title all of my new subs as I upload.  You know what's in the batch, so soon as it begins uploading you can title it. 

For instance, a few months back one of my uploads was of chocolate cake, home made. Titling "Chocolate Cake" allows me to find that subject in AIM should I want to duplicate some of the tags for a newly uploaded image.

 

And Geoff, you are so right about the forum having a forlorn air without Philippe. His personality is larger than life and he injected that energy into his posts.  

There was another Geoff (Kidd) who was very knowledgeable that I believe was driven out a few years ago because a few people were very argumentative with nearly anything he said. He helped me years ago more than I can say through PMs explaining how to do cutouts among other PS skills. A good guy and a gentleman.

And remember Linda Matlow? She withdrew her images to protect them. She's still busy shooting celebs in Chicago. She was up for trying out about every new camera. :D Miss her on the forum, too. But I keep up with her on social media.

Betty

Didn't know Philippe had gone? That's a shame, he seemed a good guy to me too and always gave good advice, I vaguely remember Linda & Geoff too.

 

I hope he's ok and wish him all the best, if anyone actually speaks to him, let him know please

Chris

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Continuing to go off topic.....

Whatever happened to David Kilpatrick ? A useful source of technical hardware knowledge.

 

Geoff (not the one that's gone AWOL)

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1 hour ago, geoff s said:

Continuing to go off topic.....

Whatever happened to David Kilpatrick ? A useful source of technical hardware knowledge.

 

Geoff (not the one that's gone AWOL)

 

I understand that today he is at Photovision in Ireland promoting Cameracraft. He is on Facebook 

Edited by geogphotos

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48 minutes ago, geogphotos said:

 

I understand that today he is at Photovision in Ireland promoting Cameracraft. He is on Facebook 

Happy to know he's still active. Wish he was active here. I always trusted his expertise.

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Hi Betty and others,

 

Betty, you said in one comment,

 

"My legacy images did not transition well in the new AIM.  Many broken tags with a single end letter missing from a tag and the single letter in a tag box all by itself.  How would you feel about a tag "bird" ending up "bir" "d"?  Every phrase where I used quotes completely shattered. Long strings of what should be single tags clumped together in one tag box."

 

I have not really looked much at keywords in my legacy images for reasons already explained. However only a very small proportion have the problem of loads of keywords all merged in to one tag. Is anyone aware of any reason why that should have happened in those particular instances, and, more importantly, does anyone know of a way of searching out those legacy images where it might have happened, to make repair easier?

 

Kind regards

 

Kumar (the Doc one)

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