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Hi, I'm having a few days in France next week and should have time for shooting editorial.

I'm aware that thngs aren't as 'liberal' here as they are here (many years ago, long before I was shooting stock, I was bawled at by a French woman for shooting a group of people practicing martial arts in the Jardin de Luxembourg [iIRC]), but searchng the forums here on 'France' didn't highlight any obvious info.

I Googled, and got some English language sites which weren't necessarily authoritative (and the info contradicted each other), and a couple of French sites which were probably authoritative, but neither my French nor auto-translate was up to the nuances.

 

Does anyone know of an authoritative (not speculative) English language site where I can find what is and not permissable when shooting editorial in France?

TIA

Edited by Cryptoprocta

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It's so sad that it now seems so difficult to do street/documentary photography in France (and many other countries for that matter) and that this question even has to be asked. In many ways France pioneered the early days of photojournalism: Cartier-Bresson, Gamma, Magnum, Doisneau, Brassai and others before and since.

Edited by Martin P Wilson
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I just got back from a holiday in Barcelona (I don't think Philippe's, "I'm from Barcelona... " suggestion would work for me... :) ). Due to a death in the family immediately before the holiday, I didn't get chance to see what is and isn't allowed in Spain so I decided to take the photos anyway (with common sense as to what is acceptable applied) and decide what I can upload afterwards. And I think if truth be known, the situation is similar to France. As a consequence, I am ditching loads of pictures of individuals or small groups of people doing interesting things. I am keeping images which contains crowds or where there is the occasional person which is inconsequential to the subject which I am actually photographing. The exceptions I am making to this is when the people which are subjects are either my family (obviously) or are a street performers where I have dropped a couple of Euros into their collection and then taken a couple of pictures.

 

Also be aware that landmarks in France (like the Eiffel Tower) are privately owned and require a property release to sell commercially.

 

And finally, don't take anything that anyone says in this thread as the defacto truth.. be aware that these are just people's opinions...

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I just got back from a holiday in Barcelona (I don't think Philippe's, "I'm from Barcelona... " suggestion would work for me... :) ). Due to a death in the family immediately before the holiday, I didn't get chance to see what is and isn't allowed in Spain so I decided to take the photos anyway (with common sense as to what is acceptable applied) and decide what I can upload afterwards. And I think if truth be known, the situation is similar to France. As a consequence, I am ditching loads of pictures of individuals or small groups of people doing interesting things. I am keeping images which contains crowds or where there is the occasional person which is inconsequential to the subject which I am actually photographing. The exceptions I am making to this is when the people which are subjects are either my family (obviously) or are a street performers where I have dropped a couple of Euros into their collection and then taken a couple of pictures.

 

Also be aware that landmarks in France (like the Eiffel Tower) are privately owned and require a property release to sell commercially.

 

And finally, don't take anything that anyone says in this thread as the defacto truth.. be aware that these are just people's opinions...

What makes you believe you can't even upload these images? Have you found out some specific information (which of course could only apply in Spain anyway)?

 

Incidentally I have no trouble licensing unreleased images of individuals and private property in France- not even to French publications. Ditto Portugal, Germany, Belgium, Greece, Norway, Italy and the Netherlands.

Edited by spacecadet

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I just got back from a holiday in Barcelona (I don't think Philippe's, "I'm from Barcelona... " suggestion would work for me... :) ). Due to a death in the family immediately before the holiday, I didn't get chance to see what is and isn't allowed in Spain so I decided to take the photos anyway (with common sense as to what is acceptable applied) and decide what I can upload afterwards. And I think if truth be known, the situation is similar to France. As a consequence, I am ditching loads of pictures of individuals or small groups of people doing interesting things. I am keeping images which contains crowds or where there is the occasional person which is inconsequential to the subject which I am actually photographing. The exceptions I am making to this is when the people which are subjects are either my family (obviously) or are a street performers where I have dropped a couple of Euros into their collection and then taken a couple of pictures.

 

Also be aware that landmarks in France (like the Eiffel Tower) are privately owned and require a property release to sell commercially.

 

And finally, don't take anything that anyone says in this thread as the defacto truth.. be aware that these are just people's opinions...

What makes you believe you can't even upload these images? Have you found out some specific information (which of course could only apply in Spain anyway)?

 

 

I went to Google and read the following...

 

http://www.spanishunlimited.com/spain/culture/2014/10/taking-pictures-in-spain

 

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Photography_legislation

 

this site states:

 

Spain
  • Taking photos of unmoveable obstacles (like houses, rails, streets, etc...) is legal
  • Taking photos containing persons is illegal unless:
    • The persons agreed
    • The photo is taken in a rellevance show or event (concert, manifestation, etc.)

 

http://www.fodors.com/community/europe/warning-to-travelers-in-spain.cfm

 

.. I read enough to decide not take the risk. Certainly pictures of children in Spain are off-limits.

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I just got back from a holiday in Barcelona (I don't think Philippe's, "I'm from Barcelona... " suggestion would work for me... :) ). Due to a death in the family immediately before the holiday, I didn't get chance to see what is and isn't allowed in Spain so I decided to take the photos anyway (with common sense as to what is acceptable applied) and decide what I can upload afterwards. And I think if truth be known, the situation is similar to France. As a consequence, I am ditching loads of pictures of individuals or small groups of people doing interesting things. I am keeping images which contains crowds or where there is the occasional person which is inconsequential to the subject which I am actually photographing. The exceptions I am making to this is when the people which are subjects are either my family (obviously) or are a street performers where I have dropped a couple of Euros into their collection and then taken a couple of pictures.

 

Also be aware that landmarks in France (like the Eiffel Tower) are privately owned and require a property release to sell commercially.

 

And finally, don't take anything that anyone says in this thread as the defacto truth.. be aware that these are just people's opinions...

What makes you believe you can't even upload these images? Have you found out some specific information (which of course could only apply in Spain anyway)?

 

 

I went to Google and read the following...

 

http://www.spanishunlimited.com/spain/culture/2014/10/taking-pictures-in-spain

 

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Photography_legislation

 

this site states:

 

Spain
  • Taking photos of unmoveable obstacles (like houses, rails, streets, etc...) is legal
  • Taking photos containing persons is illegal unless:
    • The persons agreed
    • The photo is taken in a rellevance show or event (concert, manifestation, etc.)

 

http://www.fodors.com/community/europe/warning-to-travelers-in-spain.cfm

 

.. I read enough to decide not take the risk. Certainly pictures of children in Spain are off-limits.

 

But you had already taken the photographs. Those laws only apply in Spain.

I think those sources are also subject to your warning about opinions.

Edited by spacecadet

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I just got back from a holiday in Barcelona (I don't think Philippe's, "I'm from Barcelona... " suggestion would work for me... :) ). Due to a death in the family immediately before the holiday, I didn't get chance to see what is and isn't allowed in Spain so I decided to take the photos anyway (with common sense as to what is acceptable applied) and decide what I can upload afterwards. And I think if truth be known, the situation is similar to France. As a consequence, I am ditching loads of pictures of individuals or small groups of people doing interesting things. I am keeping images which contains crowds or where there is the occasional person which is inconsequential to the subject which I am actually photographing. The exceptions I am making to this is when the people which are subjects are either my family (obviously) or are a street performers where I have dropped a couple of Euros into their collection and then taken a couple of pictures.

 

Also be aware that landmarks in France (like the Eiffel Tower) are privately owned and require a property release to sell commercially.

 

And finally, don't take anything that anyone says in this thread as the defacto truth.. be aware that these are just people's opinions...

 

Unless it has changed, it is only the illumination that is protected, not the Eiffel Tower itself.

 

Cheers,

Philippe

 

 

Quick google search again...

 

http://www.diyphotography.net/10-famous-landmarks-youre-allowed-photograph-commercial-use/

 

.. suggests that you are correct!

Edited by Matt Ashmore

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But you had already taken the photographs. Those laws only apply in Spain.

 

 

I think those sources are also subject to your warning about opinions.

 

 

Very true. I'm fairly risk averse so tend to play safe... probably more so than I should be in many cases. I think we present different opinions..  it's up the OP to make a choice.

Edited by Matt Ashmore

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The French take their rights to privacy rather seriously, but that doesn't mean you have to go to great lengths to keep all people out of your photographs. If there are topless bathers on a beach use your loaf and at least don't feature them in the foreground. Leave the lovers alone is a good rule. The current trend for people to photograph EVERYTHING on their mobiles is probably working for our benefit. Unless one has been deaf to all advice, we should all know about not shooting the illuminations of The Eiffel Tower. Exteriors are generally OK, interiors probably best left alone. Generally speaking, France poses very few problems

 

It's not the taking of the photographs that will be any problem, it's the publishing that just might be problematic. So snap away, but perhaps make a few deletions at the editing stage once you are home.

Edited by Robert M Estall
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I just got back from a holiday in Barcelona (I don't think Philippe's, "I'm from Barcelona... " suggestion would work for me... :) ). Due to a death in the family immediately before the holiday, I didn't get chance to see what is and isn't allowed in Spain so I decided to take the photos anyway (with common sense as to what is acceptable applied) and decide what I can upload afterwards. And I think if truth be known, the situation is similar to France. As a consequence, I am ditching loads of pictures of individuals or small groups of people doing interesting things. I am keeping images which contains crowds or where there is the occasional person which is inconsequential to the subject which I am actually photographing. The exceptions I am making to this is when the people which are subjects are either my family (obviously) or are a street performers where I have dropped a couple of Euros into their collection and then taken a couple of pictures.

 

Also be aware that landmarks in France (like the Eiffel Tower) are privately owned and require a property release to sell commercially.

 

And finally, don't take anything that anyone says in this thread as the defacto truth.. be aware that these are just people's opinions...

What makes you believe you can't even upload these images? Have you found out some specific information (which of course could only apply in Spain anyway)?

 

 

I went to Google and read the following...

 

http://www.spanishunlimited.com/spain/culture/2014/10/taking-pictures-in-spain

 

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Photography_legislation

 

this site states:

 

Spain
  • Taking photos of unmoveable obstacles (like houses, rails, streets, etc...) is legal
  • Taking photos containing persons is illegal unless:
    • The persons agreed
    • The photo is taken in a rellevance show or event (concert, manifestation, etc.)

 

http://www.fodors.com/community/europe/warning-to-travelers-in-spain.cfm

 

.. I read enough to decide not take the risk. Certainly pictures of children in Spain are off-limits.

 

 

In relation to Spain, I think you are pretty much correct. Here are a few edited interpretations from advice on the Spanish Age Fotostock website - these are an Alamy distributor so hopefully Alamy won't mind the reference to another agency.

 

In Spain, pictures that show a recognisable person can be used for editorial purposes without a model release if they meet the following conditions:

taken in a public place during a newsworthy event

used to illustrate an article

the person should not be main subject unless it is a public figure

photos should not offend or embarrass the subject

 

I interpret this to mean that any other usage requires a model release.

 

There is more detail on the Age Fotostock website about Spanish law in relatiion to photography. I think property is pretty much the same as in the UK if I am interpreting it correctly.

Edited by MDM

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7-day Paris roam-around in 2014;

1192 keepers, only one person, a waiter, waved camera off...

(but that was pre Charlie Hebdo)

 

The problem is/was not Charlie Hebdo, but Lady Di re:photography in Paris/France.

The French don't seem to think photographers are plotting terrorist acts.

Some may think photographers are terrorists themselves just not the ones with knives, guns or du boum.

 

explanation 1

explanation 2

 

wim

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I've never heard of women photographers getting in this sort of trouble.

Nor privacy, nor children, nor terrorism related.

So as a male either do a Bruce/Caitlyn or abstain?

Maybe go to more civilized regions of the earth.

Or to the opposite: the absolute male dominated regions.

 

wim

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I was confronted by a guy in my great NYC once because he thought I was taking his photo (I wasn't). He looked and sounded like someone I would not like to argue with for sure. I just told him what I was taking a picture of and he went on with his girlfriend. Maybe he was trying to impress her. I'd love to think she told him off but she was probably a bit afraid of him too.

 

Paulette

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I was confronted by a guy in my great NYC once because he thought I was taking his photo (I wasn't). He looked and sounded like someone I would not like to argue with for sure. I just told him what I was taking a picture of and he went on with his girlfriend. Maybe he was trying to impress her. I'd love to think she told him off but she was probably a bit afraid of him too.

 

Paulette

 

I bet you were glad you were not a male photographer taking a picture of his girlfriend.

;-)

 

wim

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