"Personal Use" as option when buying an image

[TokyoM1ke]

 

My take on this is that people are worried that buyers may exceed their licensed usage and do something else with the image.  Of course that's true, I've seen umpteen threads asking for advice regarding double usage (one live one running at the moment) and other infringements. This is much the same as the problem the music and film distributors face; once it's out there, it's out there! To my mind there are a couple of "protections" in selling on Alamy:

1. they only sell JPG files which only have an 8 bit colour depth, markedly different from the 12 bit colour depth I get from my camera. If you want the highest-quality print you cannot get it from the Alamy image.
2. Alamy don't actually print it for them. If people want a personal print, going to a POD site or otherwise getting it printed is much easier and more reliable, the cost probably isn't greater than doing it yourself, if you're not experienced in printing.  I actually think that it's a bit of an odd bird that wants to buy an Alamy image to print for themselves. On the other hand, if they're making their own wallpaper or something then... well, good luck to them!

I do sell prints (infrequently but at good prices) but I tend to be a little selective as to which of those I also put on Alamy.  If someone's printing it for private use I really can't see that you can do much unless they inadvertently invite you for Sunday lunch and you spot it on their wall.

 

[rucksack off, sorry if I was rambling a bit]

I have to disagree with your printing analysis Mike, I use a well known Pro UK lab they print up to 60" x 40" and do this from their recommended 8 bit colour file, so their is no "protection". 

 

I agree to a point - all I'm saying is that if you want maximum quality you need better than 8 bit colour. My monochrome images are very different at 8 bit than they are at 16 (12 really) or, with HDR, full 32 bit.

 

So, depending on what people are after, it may or may not make a difference.

[ChrisC]

 

The prices are ridiculous, I've also had a couple,

one image for $20

 

Country: Worldwide

Usage: Personal use

Media: Non-commercial, one time, personal/home use

Start: 25 February 2016

End: 25 February 2021

 

Why such a long release and if it's only one time, how can that be policed, plus what size image are they receiving, if it's full size, they can do what they want with it? This is of a sportsman

 

and another of one image this time for a better price $60, but for 5 copies?

Country: United Kingdom

Usage: Indoor display

Media: Shop/restaurant decoration

Industry sector: General business services

Print run: up to 5

Image Size: up to full area

Start: 30 June 2015

End: 30 June 2016

Life of Display

 

Are Alamy printing these? Why would anyone print 5 of one item, sounds dodgy to me, especially as it is a band.

 

There should be an easier click button, to opt out of these "home" sales.

I had a distributor sale to Russia middle of last year for a print for a restaurant for over $500. 1 copy.

[ChrisC]

That is brilliant, I wouldn't expect that much, that is practically the opposite end of the spectrum for what this thread has mentioned.

I wonder if any other people have had print sales for reasonable amounts, or is it the bottom falling out of the market?

[ChrisC]

 

 

My take on this is that people are worried that buyers may exceed their licensed usage and do something else with the image. Of course that's true, I've seen umpteen threads asking for advice regarding double usage (one live one running at the moment) and other infringements. This is much the same as the problem the music and film distributors face; once it's out there, it's out there! To my mind there are a couple of "protections" in selling on Alamy:

• they only sell JPG files which only have an 8 bit colour depth, markedly different from the 12 bit colour depth I get from my camera. If you want the highest-quality print you cannot get it from the Alamy image.
• Alamy don't actually print it for them. If people want a personal print, going to a POD site or otherwise getting it printed is much easier and more reliable, the cost probably isn't greater than doing it yourself, if you're not experienced in printing. I actually think that it's a bit of an odd bird that wants to buy an Alamy image to print for themselves. On the other hand, if they're making their own wallpaper or something then... well, good luck to them!

I do sell prints (infrequently but at good prices) but I tend to be a little selective as to which of those I also put on Alamy. If someone's printing it for private use I really can't see that you can do much unless they inadvertently invite you for Sunday lunch and you spot it on their wall.

 

[rucksack off, sorry if I was rambling a bit]

I have to disagree with your printing analysis Mike, I use a well known Pro UK lab they print up to 60" x 40" and do this from their recommended 8 bit colour file, so their is no "protection".

I agree to a point - all I'm saying is that if you want maximum quality you need better than 8 bit colour. My monochrome images are very different at 8 bit than they are at 16 (12 really) or, with HDR, full 32 bit.

 

So, depending on what people are after, it may or may not make a difference.

[ChrisC]

Yeah I know and understand that, I also know many photographers, who go into infinate detail on print quality, also many photographers who do the same thing with camera, or lens detail and quality.

 

But with regards to this thread and particularly giving our files to personal use customers in the UK, as a large printable 8 bit file. The customer will be delighted with the quality as will almost all photographers, as its fine by professional UK lab standards.

 

The point is if the price is so low to personal use customers, there should be an easier opt really. Going through the tabs quickly last night it didn't come across as a simple option, it looked like it affected other ways of selling your images

[skylineboy]

im not a fan of the idea of this personal use, not on alamy anyway.

 

i DO however get the idea, perhaps for someone to make wall decor etc out of. and i have approched copyright holders myself for this years ago (for a gift).

 

but its open to abuse, and gives a high chance will be infringed, and something else to chase, these people as well as bigger players (who should know better).

 

but personally i have sold personal use prints a lot, in fact, actively going looking to find out info on some images (ID help / info help for my own catalogue), and then having people who either have liked my images after helping me ID, or some of the best paid ones have been car photos were the owner or ex owner has wanted a print or poster etc of the car!

 

but i would be thinking an opt out on alamy is a good idea!

[Bill Brooks]

It is impossible to protect from use abuse in the digital age, regardless of the price.

 

There is a case of a USA book publisher who simply purchased a use at the lower end of the price scale, and then used the image for a higher price use.

 

They admitted the policy in court.

 

Price had little to do with it however, as they did it with high priced images as well.

[John Mitchell]

It is impossible to protect from use abuse in the digital age, regardless of the price.

 

There is a case of a USA book publisher who simply purchased a use at the lower end of the price scale, and then used the image for a higher price use.

 

They admitted the policy in court.

 

Price had little to do with it however, as they did it with high priced images as well.

 

I tend to agree, the Myth of Sisyphus always comes to mind when I think about chasing down digital abusers (not that we shouldn't).

 

Come to think of it, whatever happened to all those infamous "spot use" licenses from Eastern Europe and beyond? I haven't seen one for a long time.

[Martin P Wilson]

 

It is impossible to protect from use abuse in the digital age, regardless of the price.

 

There is a case of a USA book publisher who simply purchased a use at the lower end of the price scale, and then used the image for a higher price use.

 

They admitted the policy in court.

 

Price had little to do with it however, as they did it with high priced images as well.

 

I tend to agree, the Myth of Sisyphus always comes to mind when I think about chasing down digital abusers (not that we shouldn't).

 

Come to think of it, whatever happened to all those infamous "spot use" licenses from Eastern Europe and beyond? I haven't seen one for a long time.

 

 

Perhaps Alamy is getting canny about what it accepts from where in terms of sales requests?

[John Mitchell]

 

 

It is impossible to protect from use abuse in the digital age, regardless of the price.

 

There is a case of a USA book publisher who simply purchased a use at the lower end of the price scale, and then used the image for a higher price use.

 

They admitted the policy in court.

 

Price had little to do with it however, as they did it with high priced images as well.

 

I tend to agree, the Myth of Sisyphus always comes to mind when I think about chasing down digital abusers (not that we shouldn't).

 

Come to think of it, whatever happened to all those infamous "spot use" licenses from Eastern Europe and beyond? I haven't seen one for a long time.

 

 

Perhaps Alamy is getting canny about what it accepts from where in terms of sales requests?

 

 

Right, I imagine that it has been a learning process for them too.

[AlbertSnapper]

 

 

Come to think of it, whatever happened to all those infamous "spot use" licenses from Eastern Europe and beyond? I haven't seen one for a long time.

 

All online uses now aren't they ?

[chrumu]

As the replies here have been almost unanimously negative about the change, it would be nice to get an official statement from Alamy on the opt-out proposal made here by several people.

[Stokie]

DJNGWE AJK13585 John Keates 29 March 2016 Rights Managed Country: Worldwide

Usage: Personal use, Personal prints, cards and gifts. Non-commercial use only, not for resale.

Media: Non-commercial, one time, personal/home use

Start: 29 March 2016

End: 29 March 2021 $ 14.99

 

I can see this looking very nice on someone's living room wall!  

[Keith Douglas]

I've just had a Personal Use sale:

 

Country: Worldwide
Usage: Personal use, Personal prints, cards and gifts. Non-commercial use only, not for resale.
Media: Non-commercial, one time, personal/home use
Start: 29 March 2016
End: 29 March 2021

 

The image is of a sign of a UK Bank! Perhaps the buyer wants a picture at home to remind them of work?

 

In this case I see the personal use sale as a bonus. It's not an image that I, or anyone else could exploit commercially without risking getting into trouble with the organisation who owns the logo.

[ChrisC]

LOL

 

DJNGWE AJK13585 John Keates 29 March 2016 Rights Managed Country: Worldwide
Usage: Personal use, Personal prints, cards and gifts. Non-commercial use only, not for resale.
Media: Non-commercial, one time, personal/home use
Start: 29 March 2016
End: 29 March 2021 $ 14.99

 

I can see this looking very nice on someone's living room wall!  

 

 

 

I've just had a Personal Use sale:

 

Country: Worldwide
Usage: Personal use, Personal prints, cards and gifts. Non-commercial use only, not for resale.
Media: Non-commercial, one time, personal/home use
Start: 29 March 2016
End: 29 March 2021

 

The image is of a sign of a UK Bank! Perhaps the buyer wants a picture at home to remind them of work?

 

In this case I see the personal use sale as a bonus. It's not an image that I, or anyone else could exploit commercially without risking getting into trouble with the organisation who owns the logo.

LOL Maybe we are missing the fact there is a new trend in home decor

[losdemas]

Has anybody here actually sold one of those so-called "Personal use" licenses of a picture like those found at FAA (a nice landscape / picturesque cityscape / close-up of a horse / jumping dolphins / or whatever which is decorative or pleasing to look at)?

 

Cheers,

Philippe

 

 

Does this count?

 

EDIT: Maybe I should be happy that this appears to be an example of success in your 'Favourite Images Uploaded (this) Month'/'Picture Series' threads, Philippe?  I have just realised that (coincidence or not?) I put this image in the Favourite Images thread for January (2015).  I guess that it could have been found via a Google search?

 

...(still struggling to be happy about the subject)...

[losdemas]

Nice 

 

What did you get? ................ $ 14.00? 

 

I also have flowers for sale at POD sites. They could bring me € 250. That's my point. Alamy is undercutting my side-business and I'm not pleased with it.

 

 

About the picture I posted in my previous reply, that one will clearly not be used to hang on a wall. Just wondering WHAT it'll be used for 

 

Cheers,

Philippe

Hey! Let's not forget the 48¢

 

I do get your point entirely, Philippe.  I recently removed an image from here for precisely that reason.

 

Your arcade image, along with Stokie's in-flight image, are clearly not going to be hung in someone's hallway.  It is just possible, however, that my flowers might.  It does however seem very unlikely that, despite Alamy's reach, your 'average Joe' will come here hunting for decorative imagery and I can't help but share your scepticism.

[John Mitchell]

 

Nice 

 

What did you get? ................ $ 14.00? 

 

I also have flowers for sale at POD sites. They could bring me € 250. That's my point. Alamy is undercutting my side-business and I'm not pleased with it.

 

 

About the picture I posted in my previous reply, that one will clearly not be used to hang on a wall. Just wondering WHAT it'll be used for 

 

Cheers,

Philippe

Hey! Let's not forget the 48¢

 

I do get your point entirely, Philippe.  I recently removed an image from here for precisely that reason.

 

Your arcade image, along with Stokie's in-flight image, are clearly not going to be hung in someone's hallway.  It is just possible, however, that my flowers might.  It does however seem very unlikely that, despite Alamy's reach, your 'average Joe' will come here hunting for decorative imagery and I can't help but share your scepticism.

 

 

Just to play the devil's advocate, I've made some sales on POD sites that have really surprised me. People sometimes order prints that have sentimental value for them rather than for the image's aesthetic qualities. For instance, someone might have visited the arcade (or one like it) in Philippe's image as a child and had fond memories -- i.e. straight documentary images can sell as prints.

[John Mitchell]

 

 

 

Nice 

 

What did you get? ................ $ 14.00? 

 

I also have flowers for sale at POD sites. They could bring me € 250. That's my point. Alamy is undercutting my side-business and I'm not pleased with it.

 

 

About the picture I posted in my previous reply, that one will clearly not be used to hang on a wall. Just wondering WHAT it'll be used for 

 

Cheers,

Philippe

Hey! Let's not forget the 48¢

 

I do get your point entirely, Philippe.  I recently removed an image from here for precisely that reason.

 

Your arcade image, along with Stokie's in-flight image, are clearly not going to be hung in someone's hallway.  It is just possible, however, that my flowers might.  It does however seem very unlikely that, despite Alamy's reach, your 'average Joe' will come here hunting for decorative imagery and I can't help but share your scepticism.

 

 

Just to play the devil's advocate, I've made some sales on POD sites that have really surprised me. People sometimes order prints that have sentimental value for them rather than for the image's aesthetic qualities. For instance, someone might have visited the arcade in Philippe's image as a child and had fond memories -- i.e. straight documentary images can sell as prints.

 

 

You'd place  on a POD site .....????? 

 

Cheers,

Philippe

 

 

Probably not, but someone else might. Arcades like that are still very popular in some places -- e.g. the American Midwest.

 

P.S. I did say that I was playing the devil's advocate.

[ChrisC]

 

Nice 

 

What did you get? ................ $ 14.00? 

 

I also have flowers for sale at POD sites. They could bring me € 250. That's my point. Alamy is undercutting my side-business and I'm not pleased with it.

 

 

About the picture I posted in my previous reply, that one will clearly not be used to hang on a wall. Just wondering WHAT it'll be used for 

 

Cheers,

Philippe

Hey! Let's not forget the 48¢

 

I do get your point entirely, Philippe.  I recently removed an image from here for precisely that reason.

 

Your arcade image, along with Stokie's in-flight image, are clearly not going to be hung in someone's hallway.  It is just possible, however, that my flowers might.  It does however seem very unlikely that, despite Alamy's reach, your 'average Joe' will come here hunting for decorative imagery and I can't help but share your scepticism.

 

 

I'm totally cynical seeing as my two above, for the first one is for one time personal home use, the second one was 5 printed copies for a shop/restaurant display area, up to full area??? Just like yours above, it makes no sense for  I can't see them being used for this usage.

 

Having just clicked on your flower pictures, looking at the prices and the message that says Quick and simple checkout - no credits, no subscriptions, no need to register! , it is easy to see why these low personal sales are happening.

 

I think It definitely needs an easier option on upload to opt out of these sales if we want to.

[John Mitchell]

John beat me to it. Some of the subject matters of my sales on POD surprise me in the extreme. My best seller especially.

 

That's not to say that I dont agree with the overal sentiment of this thread... but sometimes maybe people want a photo of something very weird on a t-shirt.

 

I've sold a print of a toilet. Mind you, it was a pretty toilet.

 

I'm suspicious about some "personal use" sales as well, but there's really no way of second-guessing why someone might want a print of something.

[Paul Mayall]

 

 

15 images for personal use, is someone wallpapering their room with them?

 

Sorry to say Callie, More likely selling as prints at the local street markets for a few dollars,  i am sure you have already thought along those lines.

 

Alamy we have problem!

[John Mitchell]

 

P.S. I did say that I was playing the devil's advocate. 

 

I forgive you Mr Beelzebub LOL

 

Cheers,

Philippe

 

 

Actually, I just work for Mr Beelzebub -- he takes a 70% cut.

[John Mitchell]

The pretty toilet that I mentioned above has leased on Alamy for $167.50  to a Swiss newspaper. I only made $30 on FAA for a small print of the same toilet. It has yet sell for "personal use," but that day may come. 

[skylineboy]

The pretty toilet that I mentioned above has leased on Alamy for $167.50  to a Swiss newspaper. I only made $30 on FAA for a small print of the same toilet. It has yet sell for "personal use," but that day may come. 

 

hopefully those $167.50 toilet sales become "bog" standard