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SS share price has dropped to quite a low, I wouldn't be surprised if that is on VGC's target list as well. Getty most certainly is going to be rolled into it. Give it 18-24 months and 500px, Corbis, then Getty, then SS will be a mega-library controlled by VGC. Pruning/streamlining all along, squeezing of contributors by the standard bs "we'll lower your royalties, but it is more than made up by volume", but the fact is that it is just a way to satisfy shareholders and bankroll the whole rollup. It is going to get tougher, buckle up.

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The entire Stock Industry is a mouse that has been sleeping with the elephant Getty. That is OK for the mouse until the elephant rolls over.

 
The elephant just rolled over.
 
This deal will have an effect on the entire stock photo industry. Not just those in the Corbis/Getty orbit.
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The entire Stock Industry is a mouse that has been sleeping with the elephant Getty. That is OK for the mouse until the elephant rolls over.

 

The elephant just rolled over.

 

This deal will have an effect on the entire stock photo industry. Not just those in the Corbis/Getty orbit.

Well said.

 

The main assumption has to be that whatever is coming down the line will first impact on those fishing in the same pool: general stock agencies supplying editorial and commercial content. One possible outcome will be that they will be forced either to invest more than they can afford or die. That’s what happened to the old UK editorial agencies when much more efficient and streamlined operations came into being such as Alamy. But at least it was the old agencies that still had the best editorial content – making it worthwhile to phone a library manager occasionally to see if they could dig something out of dusty files. Least affected were niche agencies providing unique content to small pools of buyers.

 

The main sign of serious impending trouble is when RPI drops to such a low that contributors simply can’t afford to supply work unless it is subsidised by other activities, or as spin-offs from assignment work. Seen it happen a number of times.

Edited by Robert Brook

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The entire Stock Industry is a mouse that has been sleeping with the elephant Getty. That is OK for the mouse until the elephant rolls over.

 

The elephant just rolled over.

 

This deal will have an effect on the entire stock photo industry. Not just those in the Corbis/Getty orbit.

Well said.

 

The main assumption has to be that whatever is coming down the line will first impact on those fishing in the same pool: general stock agencies supplying editorial and commercial content. One possible outcome will be that they will be forced either to invest more than they can afford or die. That’s what happened to the old UK editorial agencies when much more efficient and streamlined operations came into being such as Alamy. But at least it was the old agencies that still had the best editorial content – making it worthwhile to phone a library manager occasionally to see if they could dig something out of dusty files. Least affected were niche agencies providing unique content to small pools of buyers.

 

The main sign of serious impending trouble is when RPI drops to such a low that contributors simply can’t afford to supply work unless it is subsidised by other activities, or as spin-offs from assignment work. Seen it happen a number of times.

 

 

 

I would suggest that for most people that point has already been passed, if only they, we, would face up to it. But in a crowd sourced world most contributors are not looking at in that way; it is pin money, an offshoot of hobby they will pursue anyway. They will continue to take the photos/videos come what may.

Edited by Martin P Wilson
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Many agencies cannot be making enough to even pay their staff on the prices that images are being sold for. There needs to be two  sections  RF embodying microstock,  and original RM images for people who have a little more cash to spend on something better. The two are being mixed up now to the detriment of people who shoot RM. Getty main page now defaults to RF only, I cannot understand the crazy logic of this.  One place agencies can raise a little more revenue is by offering and advertising RM as something slightly superior.  If it is or not doesnt matter,  but there are people who will pay extra for something that is marketed as superior.  Why the agencies are trying to drag everything down to the cheapest level I really cannot understand. Market RM as superior and try and raise the sale prices .

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Many agencies cannot be making enough to even pay their staff on the prices that images are being sold for. There needs to be two  sections  RF embodying microstock,  and original RM images for people who have a little more cash to spend on something better. The two are being mixed up now to the detriment of people who shoot RM. Getty main page now defaults to RF only, I cannot understand the crazy logic of this.  One place agencies can raise a little more revenue is by offering and advertising RM as something slightly superior.  If it is or not doesnt matter,  but there are people who will pay extra for something that is marketed as superior.  Why the agencies are trying to drag everything down to the cheapest level I really cannot understand. Market RM as superior and try and raise the sale prices .

Shutterstock created Offset, and Getty Presige, perhaps because they realised that those needing to and prepared to spend more, can take the time and trouble to visit small niche collections where they won't have to wade through a pile of junk, and where the best work is to be found. As the world gets bigger, it might get smaller, and more exclusive too. Nothing new there.

 

(i.e. just sticking prices up in the main body of a very big collection simply on the basis of a license - barely rights managed here, anyway - isn't going to work)

Edited by Robert Brook
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One offshoot of all this is that Alamy will probably no longer be able to say that it has the "world's largest stock photo collection." But perhaps that's a good thing. A mere 65 million images could now make Alamy look more exclusive. B)

 

Seriously, though, it does sound as if Alamy will have to re-position and redefine itself somehow. Hopefully, this can be done without it losing its integrity.

Edited by John Mitchell
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Almost all of my Video and stills are RM. They are being sold in some instances for peanuts. Let people who want to pay peanuts go to a microstock agency. Why cant we make stand and say this is what it costs. I cannot afford to even travel to Europe on a speculative shoot anymore. I  would love to set a minimum price for my images as you can on POND5 for example.

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Many agencies cannot be making enough to even pay their staff on the prices that images are being sold for. There needs to be two  sections  RF embodying microstock,  and original RM images for people who have a little more cash to spend on something better. The two are being mixed up now to the detriment of people who shoot RM. Getty main page now defaults to RF only, I cannot understand the crazy logic of this.  One place agencies can raise a little more revenue is by offering and advertising RM as something slightly superior.  If it is or not doesnt matter,  but there are people who will pay extra for something that is marketed as superior.  Why the agencies are trying to drag everything down to the cheapest level I really cannot understand. Market RM as superior and try and raise the sale prices .

 

Rf has now become the default for most commercial customers, that was foreseen a few years ago by Getty and if you look at any industry trending report or survey, it's what clients are after. Shooting RM with little added value, especially commercially, just adds to the notion of asking clients to pay for a license just because the photographer wants them to...not because the image merits it. GI have tried to solve this with Prestige..... not convinced but at least they are not being passive.

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Almost all of my Video and stills are RM. They are being sold in some instances for peanuts. Let people who want to pay peanuts go to a microstock agency. Why cant we make stand and say this is what it costs. I cannot afford to even travel to Europe on a speculative shoot anymore. I  would love to set a minimum price for my images as you can on POND5 for example.

Different subject areas and styles can now command very different fees, even if licensed as RF. I don't do travel, unless accidently, but all I hear is that agencies are giving it away, a reflection of a very bad supply and demand problem relating to secondary editorial. On the other hand licenses worth $500 or more are commonplace with sales to the US education market, and many of these are travel related images. But this is an area that is still in the hands of independent suppliers like Photo Researchers (now rebranded as ‘Science Source’). Similarly commercial agencies sell a lot of travel related imagery for high fees, sometimes thousands of dollars.

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One immediate effect... which links into my thread about crowd sourcing.

 

Citizen journalist site Demotix has disappeared. Gone. Foetsie. Disparu. Weg.

Yes- and with it the fee for an assignment from Sept 15 that demotix failed to pay me - pleased to see the back of them

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Demotix was a nice little earner for me, and a great outlet for alternative (i.e. not Murdoch-influenced) views on events around the world. Sad to see them go.

 

dd

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Demotix was a nice little earner for me, and a great outlet for alternative

 

Yes, in some cases. Gave me a few / some  good sales, but also impossible to contact, and not sure if I was paid for all uses. Demotix was used by some Danish agencies and media in a way I wish Alamy would inherit.

Edited by Niels Quist

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One immediate effect... which links into my thread about crowd sourcing.

 

Citizen journalist site Demotix has disappeared. Gone. Foetsie. Disparu. Weg.

Yes- and with it the fee for an assignment from Sept 15 that demotix failed to pay me - pleased to see the back of them

 

 

 

I wouldn't write it off just yet. Corbis were never the best at communicating... From my experiance of such takeovers in the past it sometimes takes a while after the initial kaboom of announcement for the dust to settle. I know of a few usages of my imiages via Demotix and I expect to get some sort of recompense.

 

Demotix did have some advantages over similar organisations... for a start they made sales.

 

 

I wouldn't be too optimistic - see their last accounts at Companies House, not pretty.

 

Demotix made sales for me, pennies in some cases. I actually got paid for about one credited use in three. Which is why I gave up on Demotix in April 2014.

 

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One immediate effect... which links into my thread about crowd sourcing.

 

Citizen journalist site Demotix has disappeared. Gone. Foetsie. Disparu. Weg.

Yes- and with it the fee for an assignment from Sept 15 that demotix failed to pay me - pleased to see the back of them

 

 

 

I wouldn't write it off just yet. Corbis were never the best at communicating... From my experiance of such takeovers in the past it sometimes takes a while after the initial kaboom of announcement for the dust to settle. I know of a few usages of my imiages via Demotix and I expect to get some sort of recompense.

 

Demotix did have some advantages over similar organisations... for a start they made sales.

 

 

They just didn't pay out on all the sales!!!  :(  :angry:

 

Phil

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In stead of Demotix there's Newzulu.

ball-of-colorful-wool-yarn-ctx3ga.jpg

On their homepage: in partnership with gettyimages, AP and AFP.

Newzulu has 19,768 images on Alamy as well.

 

wim

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Until VGC Acquire Getty ...

 

 

+1 Martin

 
Getty is a majority shareholder in VGC, as well as a new manager of the Corbis images outside China.
 
Usually in these situations Getty would provide the expertise in return for majority ownership of VGC, and the Chinese minority shareholders of VGC supply the money.
 
At some point in time, one group usually buys the other group out. There may be an understanding of how one group will buy the other out.
 
At this point in time it seems that the Chinese generally want to expand into Intellectual Property, and the owners of Getty would be ready to cash out.
 
I think the sale of Corbis is only one step in the long standing business plans of all companies involved. There will be many more steps. I think they have all been working up to this point for years.

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Until VGC Acquire Getty ...

 

 

+1 Martin

 
Getty is a majority shareholder in VGC, as well as a new manager of the Corbis images outside China.
 
Usually in these situations Getty would provide the expertise in return for majority ownership of VGC, and the Chinese minority shareholders of VGC supply the money.
 
At some point in time, one group usually buys the other group out. There may be an understanding of how one group will buy the other out.
 
At this point in time it seems that the Chinese generally want to expand into Intellectual Property, and the owners of Getty would be ready to cash out.
 
I think the sale of Corbis is only one step in the long standing business plans of all companies involved. There will be many more steps. I think they have all been working up to this point for years.

 

 

I agree, private equity funds like Carlyle (GI owners) are only in it while there is a good income stream or while there is more growth potential. With the way that Getty has supposedly been burning cash I would think Carlyle must be ready to cash in on their investment if the price is right, or there is too much future downside risk.I am

 

 

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In stead of Demotix there's Newzulu.

ball-of-colorful-wool-yarn-ctx3ga.jpg

On their homepage: in partnership with gettyimages, AP and AFP.

Newzulu has 19,768 images on Alamy as well.

 

wim

 

The problem with Newzulu is that they take up to 24 hours to approve content - by the time it's online the moment's gone. Plus their website is rubbish, slow and buggy.

 

One good thing about them was that their Sydney editorial staff were pretty proactive in communication with contributes, I often spoke to them directly, and they'd even sometimes call / email to ask if I could cover this, or that. Then they shut the office down 2 months ago. Approval is still slow, and now no communication.. I'll continue to use them - only because there's not many other options out there other than Alamy.

 

Demotix was efficient, seemed to have a broader reach and news stories were approved within an hour. And more recently for me, stories were approved instantly. Much closer to the Alamy experience.

 

Anyway, there's still Alamy! :)

Edited by David Hewison

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If I'm offered a Getty contract then I will have to make a big decision: Sign with an exclusive deal and therefore have to terminate with Alamy or decline Getty and stay with Alamy. If I've declined the Getty promise of great riches I may, under the Corbis contract, be offered a deal with the Chinese and so stay with Alamy.

 

So the question remains this Monday morning, who would make the most money, make my life less painful, allow me to pursue my latter years of shooting what I want and protect my much of my life's work from theft? All of these factors weigh heavily - but none are clear cut.

 

Rgds,

Richard.

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one thing is for sure - nothing ever stands still - and quite frankly nor should it.

 

hence I've always been wary of exclusivity - unless i have a crystal ball - which i don't

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I think Richard touches on the elephant in the room. I am not with Corbis, so this doesn't impact me directly. But would I really want to sign up to a contributor contract made subject to Chinese law, or entrust my IP with them? I think not. I have had to deal with Chinese IP registration and disputes as a lawyer on behalf of corporate clients, and there is little joy (but lots of frustration and dubious legal processes) to be had there.

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One immediate effect... which links into my thread about crowd sourcing.

 

Citizen journalist site Demotix has disappeared. Gone. Foetsie. Disparu. Weg.

Yes- and with it the fee for an assignment from Sept 15 that demotix failed to pay me - pleased to see the back of them

 

 

i was a little terse i nay late night comment above-apologies

i actually think aspects of the demotix model worked well particularly i terms of speedy approval and distribution of new images.

i am disappointed though that when asked at 24 hours notice to undertake an assignment for Demotix on behalf of their client, that i did so - and to their satisfaction and that of their client - then had to continually chase each week for the promise payment - to be met with a bewildering array of excuses including - we hadn't seen your emails - and now of course the chances of being paid are zero - rant over- but i don't work for nothing ( except in this case i clearly did)

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Liked KerinF. Very good points, thanks.

 

And Foreign Export (I like the user name!) exclusivity is not ideal for me as I also have a Photoshelter site from which I sell. Sometimes.

 

Richard

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