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I am currently using the Nikon DX cameras but was in the camera store and took a look at the Z system and was wondering if others was using them and what they think.  In the DX series I took a look at the D7500 but I wasn't sure if everything was headed for Mirrorless.

Marvin

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I have wondered about this also Marvin. I have a Nikon D5200 that is past its guaranteed shutter life but still going strong at present. But there will come a time to upgrade and I'm realising the Z series may be a good option. I was considering the D500 or D7500, but like you I'm also unsure if staying in the non-mirrorless sphere is the right way to go.

 

The Z50, Z6, Z7 and Z7II are all lighter than the D7500. The less expensive Z6 (compared with Z7) is of interest to me and would be an opportunity to go full frame with a camera body that's not too big for my small hands. I do like my range of lenses I currently use though and there is the issue of the reduced range of lenses for Nikon mirrorless at this point. I understand there is an adaptor you can buy for F mount lenses to work on mirrorless. I've been trying to get my head around what happens with a DX lens for a DSLR when used on a full-frame mirrorless body. From what I understand you get a cropped view with a loss of MPs - the same as what happens going to a non-mirrorless full frame DSLR. In this case, my current lenses would work better with the Z50 if I don't want to lose MPs. Not sure if there are any issues or disadvantages specific to using F mount lenses with an adaptor on mirrorless.

 

Would be interested in hearing from anyone who has made the switch to Nikon Z.

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I don’t think you should choose your Z series camera based on your existing lenses. Imagine buying a new car and limiting your choice to a model that could use the tyres from your old one. Yes it is a very definite advantage that Z series cameras can use older Nikon lenses but if you really want to experience the advantages of the Z series, you need to be using the new lenses designed for the cameras. The new lenses are lighter than their older equivalents and optically superb. Limiting yourself to DX format doesn’t make sense to me unless you can’t afford full frame. 
 

I don’t think you could go wrong with the Z6 with the 24-70F4 and adaptor, best bought as a kit as the separate prices are much higher. Nikon have continued to introduce firmware updates for the Z6 and Z7 which have greatly improved the cameras over the original releases. The Z6 kit is currently one of the best deals available for numerous reasons (although the Z5 is currently on special offer). 

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57 minutes ago, Sally R said:

what happens with a DX lens for a DSLR when used on a full-frame mirrorless body. From what I understand you get a cropped view with a loss of MPs

I believe that the camera would automatically switch to the DX mode if you fitted your DX lenses via the adapter so you could still use them, and they would give the same field of view  of course, However the MegaPixels are reduced by a factor of around 2.3, so the 24MP Z5 becomes about 10.4MP, the 24.5MP becomes around 10.6MP. A fresh start with full frame lenses would be a better bet. I suspect that Sony and Nikon are more likely to concentrate on full frame, Fuji will continue with APS-C & 'medium format'.

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1 hour ago, Harry Harrison said:

I believe that the camera would automatically switch to the DX mode if you fitted your DX lenses via the adapter so you could still use them, and they would give the same field of view  of course, However the MegaPixels are reduced by a factor of around 2.3, so the 24MP Z5 becomes about 10.4MP, the 24.5MP becomes around 10.6MP. A fresh start with full frame lenses would be a better bet. I suspect that Sony and Nikon are more likely to concentrate on full frame, Fuji will continue with APS-C & 'medium format'.

 

Just to clarify, I wasn't suggesting there is anything intrinsically wrong with smaller sensors (including Fuji of which I have no experience). Just that if one is going over to the Z system from a Nikon DSLR DX system, then it would certainly be worth considering the benefits of full frame and that owning existing DX lenses should not really be a deciding factor in deciding on FX versus DX, as the benefits of the Z system will only be fully realised by using lenses designed for the cameras in any case.  However, owning existing Nikon lenses  could certainly be a deciding factor in staying with Nikon rather than considering Sony or other makers. 

 

There is usually a menu option on Nikon full frame cameras for automatically changing format when a DX lenses is mounted. 

Edited by MDM
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3 minutes ago, MDM said:

Just to clarify, I wasn't suggesting there is anything intrinsically wrong with smaller sensors

No,  I didn't take it that way, I think using full-frame lenses on the Z6 would be the way to go if I was in that position and though I'm happy with Fuji because of the 'analog' nature of the controls and the compact size of the cameras (and a few other things as well!) I know that they can't match the dynamic range of full-frame Nikon or Sony in situations where that matters.

 

I think the maths is right though - 35.9 x 23.9 = 858 sq.mm. / 23.5 x 15.7 = 369 sq.mm. - 858/369 = 2.32

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2 minutes ago, Harry Harrison said:

No,  I didn't take it that way, I think using full-frame lenses on the Z6 would be the way to go if I was in that position and though I'm happy with Fuji because of the 'analog' nature of the controls and the compact size of the cameras (and a few other things as well!) I know that they can't match the dynamic range of full-frame Nikon or Sony in situations where that matters.

 

I think the maths is right though - 35.9 x 23.9 = 858 sq.mm. / 23.5 x 15.7 = 369 sq.mm. - 858/369 = 2.32

 

Yes you are right. I deleted my incorrect post and hoped it had gone unnoticed. Apologies. 😀

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I have an Z6 and the image size using my 18-105 DX  Nikon lens is 3939x3624. I didn't have to do anything to the settings of the camera when I put the lens on.

I am using my 200-500 5.6, 105  VR Micro all with AF,  80-200 2.8 push pull lens which becomes a manual focusing lens and  600mm5.6 manual lens. For the manual lens I use the focus peaking feature in the camera plus with any AF lens you get the green in focus button in the viewfinder.

What I like most about the Z6 is the viewfinder, there is so much info in it.   

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11 minutes ago, DerekVallintine said:

3939x3624

That would be 3939 x 2624 = 10.3MP. Presumably the image still fills the electronic viewfinder, something that wouldn't happen with a DX lens on a conventional full-frame Nikon DSLR.

Edited by Harry Harrison
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Just looking at Z lenses it seems they are quite a bit more expensive than the F Mount.  I think I remember where some people were having trouble with the Z adapter for F mount lenses of other brands.  Nikon may not share the lens interface data with independent lens makers.  

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Thanks Michael, yes I'm sure it is much more optimal to be using the lenses for the Z series. I was mainly thinking of ways of reducing initial costs and also still having the range of options I currently have with existing lenses, but ultimately it is better to have the dedicated mirrorless lenses. A new camera is still a way off for me, but just projecting into the future. If I can afford it, the Z6 would be a great way to get into full-frame for the first time with excellent image quality.

 

Thanks Harry. Yes I figured I'd be down to about 10ish megapixels. I think the use of any DX lenses would be a temporary measure and also not all my lenses are DX, so it won't matter with all of them. I'll keep an eye on what happens with Nikon and Sony full-frame mirrorless going forward.

 

Good to hear that you are working out a system with different lenses with the Z6 Derek, and also that you are enjoying the Z6. I noticed you are from Vancouver Island. I visited there many years ago for a few days and would love to go back. Had a look at your images and enjoyed the wildlife and scenery - such a great place for photography.

 

I noticed the cost of the Z lenses too Marvin. I have four third party lenses that I currently use regularly, so possibly there may be problems with these if Nikon may not share their interface data for the Z lens adaptor for independent lens makers. It's all in the future for me at the moment, but like you I'm wondering if going mirrorless is the way of the future and a better investment. I'll keep watching to see what happens and try and make the best decision. It will be good seeing what new lens options come out over time too. The Nikon Z50 also looks like an excellent choice and very compact for travel and more affordable, but the Z6 would excel again in terms of image quality and low light performance. If I decide the Z6 is a bit too much for me I'd definitely consider to Z50. I came across this discussion of the Z6 vs the Z50: https://www.techradar.com/au/news/nikon-z6-vs-nikon-z50-10-key-differences-you-need-to-know

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3 hours ago, Sally R said:

This article discusses the Nikon Road Map that is referred to:

 

https://photographylife.com/nikon-z-lens-roadmap

 

The actual Nikon road Map here

 

There are very few new DX lenses on the horizon though that doesn't matter as long as they make one or two that suit you. One advantage of Fuji is that (apart from their higher priced 'medium format' range) they have only ever made lenses designed for APS-C mirrorless. The disadvantage is that very few 3rd party manufacturers make them to fit Fuji, but then Fuji lenses do seem to be very good, and plentiful secondhand if needs be. That Z6 looks very good though.

 

 

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2 hours ago, Harry Harrison said:

This article discusses the Nikon Road Map that is referred to:

 

https://photographylife.com/nikon-z-lens-roadmap

 

The actual Nikon road Map here

 

There are very few new DX lenses on the horizon though that doesn't matter as long as they make one or two that suit you. One advantage of Fuji is that (apart from their higher priced 'medium format' range) they have only ever made lenses designed for APS-C mirrorless. The disadvantage is that very few 3rd party manufacturers make them to fit Fuji, but then Fuji lenses do seem to be very good, and plentiful secondhand if needs be. That Z6 looks very good though.

Thank you very much Harry! I had no idea about this road map. It is definitely helpful looking into the future.

 

Yes Fuji look like an excellent mirrorless option too, if I did go APS-C. The XT4 looks excellent and the XT3 too. I was just reading about the 100-400mm lens for Fuji. I do like wildlife photography and so I'm interested in the telephoto options out there. So much to think about. It will be interesting to see what the Nikon 200-600mm for mirrorless will cost. A lot I expect!

 

As an aside I just read this article about Pentax sticking to DSLRs rather than moving into mirrorless, and the suggestion that in the future there will be a retro interest in DSLRs that Pentax will still have a market for. The author suggests they get into making new film cameras too, to appeal to the retro film enthusiasts. My first camera as a teenager was a Pentax K1000 which I loved, so I do have a soft spot for them.

https://petapixel.com/2020/07/18/why-pentax-is-making-the-right-call-in-sticking-with-dslrs/

 

Edited by Sally R
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28 minutes ago, Sally R said:

My first camera as a teenager was a Pentax K1000 which I loved, so I do have a soft spot for them.

Interesting article, I hadn't seen it. I think it's clear from what they say that it is too late for Pentax to join the mirrorless party and to expect to make a success of it, the idea of them making a film camera seems like a better idea in fact, I still have too many film cameras knocking around. I never thought I'd be an advocate for the electronic viewfinder (EVF) and I got into Fuji through the X100 and then the X-Pro1 because of their optical 'rangefinder style' viewfinders, however the EVF is very seductive and they are very good now. It also means I can use pretty much any film era lens via an adapter.  We're lucky that there are so many types of cameras around now and you are in a position to choose whatever suits you really. I was impressed at how many respected names use Olympus Micro 4/3 for example though there is some doubt over their future unfortunately.

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When I changed my camera a few years ago, the Z system had just come out.  I find the best thing to do - but not sure about now because of Covid is to go into a camera shop and ask to try one.  This I did a couple of years ago when part exing a couple of bodies.  I took my own memory card into Park Cameras in London and they let me loose just outside the shop with an 850  so I could see how I felt about it - I was then able to take the memory card home download and have a think about what I wanted to do.  I did have a quick go with one of the Z's but time was running short.  Also the Z's  had just come out and I think only had one memory card slot whereas I prefer two.  

 

Sally about the same time a friend came over with his XT2 I think it was with a 100-400mm so I could try - it was very impressive and I even got used the electrical viewfinder after about 5/10 minutes but I'm happy with my Nikon FX for now😁

 

Carol

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55 minutes ago, Harry Harrison said:

We're lucky that there are so many types of cameras around now and you are in a position to choose whatever suits you really. I was impressed at how many respected names use Olympus Micro 4/3 for example though there is some doubt over their future unfortunately.

Yes we are so lucky now. Thanks for the link about the users of Olympus 4/3. It's great to see their quality images. I'm familiar with Andy Rouse. He was the first wildlife photographer I got into just before I bought my first DSLR in 2010. I knew he started with Canon and then went to Nikon, but didn't realise he had also gone on to use Olympus Micro 4/3. It's great to know he got great images with this gear and how lightweight, unobtrusive and handy it was for wildlife. Not that long ago I found there are quite a few of his images on Alamy: https://www.alamy.com/search/imageresults.aspx?pseudoid={0349FC8D-233C-4B71-92B1-E4B9710B228B}&name=Andy%2bRouse&st=11&mode=0&comp=1

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9 minutes ago, CAROL SAUNDERS said:

Sally about the same time a friend came over with his XT2 I think it was with a 100-400mm so I could try - it was very impressive and I even got used the electrical viewfinder after about 5/10 minutes but I'm happy with my Nikon FX for now😁

Thanks Carol. Yes I will be sticking with my Nikon DX DSLR for a while longer, but good to know about all these great options 🙂👍 I'm glad the 100-400mm was impressive.

Edited by Sally R
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14 minutes ago, Sally R said:

Not that long ago I found there are quite a few of his images on Alamy

Great pictures, inspirational. I imagine In Body Image Stabilisation (IBIS) is a real boon, the X-T4 now has that.

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On 05/02/2021 at 11:52, Sally R said:

Yes we are so lucky now. Thanks for the link about the users of Olympus 4/3. It's great to see their quality images. I'm familiar with Andy Rouse. He was the first wildlife photographer I got into just before I bought my first DSLR in 2010. I knew he started with Canon and then went to Nikon, but didn't realise he had also gone on to use Olympus Micro 4/3.

 

Not a high profile snapper but local nature and wildlife photographer and author Andrew Peters switched from Canon to m4/3 a few years ago and seems to be very happy with it (Q&A).

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I have two Z lens both cheap, one the kit lens zoom and one other zoom. Amazingly sharp! Really took me by surprise and I am used to shooting with a D5 and a 500 f4 as my most common setup.

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15 hours ago, Simon E said:

Not a high profile snapper but local nature and wildlife photographer and author Andrew Peters switched from Canon to m4/3 a few years ago and seems to be very happy with it (Q&A).

 

Thanks Simon. It's good to see his pictures. Some very nice images there. Interesting to see photographers moving to the micro 4/3 system very recently. 

 

I was looking into the specs of the m4/3 Andy Rouse uses, the Olympus E-M1X. It's a very interesting and unique camera. I watched a couple of field test reviews of it. Although it has the small sensor size, it has a function to do multiple composites to create very large 80MP images. It also has the equivalent of a tilt-shift function built in so that as you are composing your shot you can do keystone corrections in-camera at the time instead of in post-processing. It also has a built in ND filter that you can use in live view while composing, so you can see how images of something like flowing water in a landscape are going to turn out ahead of time. It has two sets of camera controls too so that you can flip to vertical and you can position your hands the same as when shooting horizontal.

 

After reading the interview link you sent I just checked out another photographer Andrew Peters mentions who has some amazing wildlife shots with Olympus gear, including the very expensive 150-400mm lens:

https://500px.com/p/sulasulacom?view=photos

 

13 hours ago, Panthera tigris said:

I have two Z lens both cheap, one the kit lens zoom and one other zoom. Amazingly sharp! Really took me by surprise and I am used to shooting with a D5 and a 500 f4 as my most common setup.

 

It's great to know about the lens sharpness quality. I do love Nikon, especially the ease of use of their menus. I've never had to read the manual for my D5200, whereas the menu on my little Sony RX100 is much more complicated. I've just read a review of the Nikon Z50 vs the Nikon D7500. Which is better seems to really depend on the individual needs of the photographer. The review is here in case it is helpful to anyone weighing up the pros and cons: https://www.digitalcameraworld.com/au/buying-guides/nikon-z-50-vs-d7500-mirrorless-vs-dslr

 

I have small hands so I was interested to also read about Sony just releasing a new full-frame camera that is very compact, the A7C. There are just so many options now with such variability it is like you have to research every camera very carefully for its particular set of features to figure out if it meets your needs. I think the Nikon Z6 would be outstanding for landscape, but maybe not the best option for wildlife, at least according to this article in regard to the speed and  accuracy of continuous autofocus tracking: https://dailywildlifephoto.nathab.com/photography-guide/nikon-z6-wildlife-photography/ The Fujifilm XT-4 seems like a very good all round option along with the Sony A6000 series in terms of mirrorless APS-C.

 

 

Edited by Sally R
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15 hours ago, Simon E said:

Not a high profile snapper but local nature and wildlife photographer and author Andrew Peters switched from Canon to m4/3 a few years ago and seems to be very happy with it (Q&A).

Yes, very impressive stuff, thanks for sharing. Clearly a very hard worker, and very skilled of course. "I can easily shoot 10,000 pictures a day". Cripes. Might be best not buy anything secondhand from him!

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On 05/02/2021 at 05:10, Sally R said:

My first camera as a teenager was a Pentax K1000 which I loved

I loved my K1000 as well - simple, great meter that gave me some of my best exposed slides, and bulletproof - you could bang your tent pegs in with it.  Some of the Pentax DSLR are excellent, but I am too invested in Nikon DSLR to consider changing.

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4 hours ago, Sally R said:

 

Thanks Simon. It's good to see his pictures. Some very nice images there. Interesting to see photographers moving to the micro 4/3 system very recently. 

 

I was looking into the specs of the m4/3 Andy Rouse uses, the Olympus E-M1X. It's a very interesting and unique camera. I watched a couple of field test reviews of it. Although it has the small sensor size, it has a function to do multiple composites to create very large 80MP images. It also has the equivalent of a tilt-shift function built in so that as you are composing your shot you can do keystone corrections in-camera at the time instead of in post-processing. It also has a built in ND filter that you can use in live view while composing, so you can see how images of something like flowing water in a landscape are going to turn out ahead of time. It has two sets of camera controls too so that you can flip to vertical and you can position your hands the same as when shooting horizontal.

 

After reading the interview link you sent I just checked out another photographer Andrew Peters mentions who has some amazing wildlife shots with Olympus gear, including the very expensive 150-400mm lens:

https://500px.com/p/sulasulacom?view=photos

 

 

It's great to know about the lens sharpness quality. I do love Nikon, especially the ease of use of their menus. I've never had to read the manual for my D5200, whereas the menu on my little Sony RX100 is much more complicated. I've just read a review of the Nikon Z50 vs the Nikon D7500. Which is better seems to really depend on the individual needs of the photographer. The review is here in case it is helpful to anyone weighing up the pros and cons: https://www.digitalcameraworld.com/au/buying-guides/nikon-z-50-vs-d7500-mirrorless-vs-dslr

 

I have small hands so I was interested to also read about Sony just releasing a new full-frame camera that is very compact, the A7C. There are just so many options now with such variability it is like you have to research every camera very carefully for its particular set of features to figure out if it meets your needs. I think the Nikon Z6 would be outstanding for landscape, but maybe not the best option for wildlife, at least according to this article in regard to the speed and  accuracy of continuous autofocus tracking: https://dailywildlifephoto.nathab.com/photography-guide/nikon-z6-wildlife-photography/ The Fujifilm XT-4 seems like a very good all round option along with the Sony A6000 series in terms of mirrorless APS-C.

 

 

 

I don't think it is a great idea to judge a camera system or a camera on the basis of great shots by an expert photographer or brand ambassador. A great photographer will be able to get great shots with the end of a bottle. Olympus are going through some mega changes at the moment so I would keep that in mind if considering Olympus. I had Olympus OM SLR kit but they stopped making the OM kit back in the 90s leaving a lot of photographers high and dry with a dead end system. That is when I went to Nikon.

 

I think the future is going to be bright for the Nikon Z system as they are putting a lot into it and some of it is cutting edge at a seriousy good price. As I mentioned above, Nikon have continued to provide firmware updates for the Z6 and Z7 cameras, even since they released the Z6II and Z67ii so one needs to be sure one is reading up to date and unbiased reviews. For example, the AF tracking has improved a lot over the original release. Check this YouTube DPReview of Z6 firmware improvements out (although even that is not up to date).

 

 

Edited by MDM
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