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My 75 year-old sister has been doubly-vaccinated since the spring, but tested positive after being exposed by a friend. She also (most likely) passed covid on to the couple she’s visiting. Because my sister has serious health issues, she was sent to a facility to receive an antibody infusion which took about an hour, then sent home to quarantine. Fortunately, my sister and her friends all experienced mild covid symptoms similar to a cold. She will now have to wait an extra three months before she receives a booster. If she hadn’t been vaccinated, most likely she would not have survived. 
 

I also know people who’ve gone and gotten an early booster, but I plan to follow the CDC guidelines and wait until at least eight months after my second shot. 

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A lady I know, not young, but maybe 60ish, was hospitalized (very ill) for a month from Covid. She was fully vaccinated. She’s being taught to walk again in a recovery home after a Covid-induced stroke.

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Could we please be careful with stories- especially anecdotal and with partial information- which might give someone- anyone- the impression that vaccination is anything other than the right thing to do.

Yes, you can still become ill, but the chances of infection transmission and illness are far, far less- this is a fact.

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Mark, information is gold. I want vaccinated people to be aware they aren’t bulletproof and to be as careful as the unvaccinated. My information isn’t anecdotal, but straight from this woman’s mouth. I’m not reported rumors, but facts. The facts as she told it.
 

If the vaccinated go about their affairs believing they are safe, don’t stay out of crowds, don’t mask, etc., they could get sick. I don’t want that. There is a real danger that both camps, vaccinated and unvaccinated, with mild cases or asymptotic, could be walking about infecting people.

Cecile’s post is indicative of that. And I don’t believe she’s trying to scare people, but make them aware. If everyone is aware, maybe we can get a handle on this thing.

 

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1 hour ago, Betty LaRue said:

 

That is a good and informed article Betty.  It is important to be aware of the fact that breakthrough infections do occur in vaccinated people and can be very serious.  

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7 minutes ago, Betty LaRue said:

Mark, information is gold. I want vaccinated people to be aware they aren’t bulletproof and to be as careful as the unvaccinated. My information isn’t anecdotal, but straight from this woman’s mouth. I’m not reported rumors, but facts. The facts as she told it.
 

If the vaccinated go about their affairs believing they are safe, don’t stay out of crowds, don’t mask, etc., they could get sick. I don’t want that. There is a real danger that both camps, vaccinated and unvaccinated, with mild cases or asymptotic, could be walking about infecting people.

Cecile’s post is indicative of that. And I don’t believe she’s trying to scare people, but make them aware. If everyone is aware, maybe we can get a handle on this thing.

 

 

Absolutely agree with this Betty. It is vital that people be aware of the facts. The feeling here is that the pandemic is almost over. That is dangerous. 

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Actually I think that there are a lot of alternative facts about vaccine efficacy emanating from the government these days, the drive seems to be to persuade everyone that they can go back to normal, and should do so for the benefit of the economy. However Johnson apparently privately accepts that 50,000 a year will die from COVID as a result of this policy, something of an inconvenient truth.  I'd rather still be getting my medical advice from the likes of Sir Patrick Vallance or Professor Chris Whitty rather than Sajid Javid or Rishi Sunak.

Edited by Harry Harrison
Spelling - Sajid Javid not David, must have been confusing him with Craig David, touch of the Gavin Williamson
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21 minutes ago, spacecadet said:

As long as they're not "alternative facts", preferably?

Science is a highly regarded journal so I don’t think that is a concern here. 
 

 

5 minutes ago, Harry Harrison said:

Actually I think that there are a lot of alternative facts about vaccine efficacy emanating from the government these days, the drive seems to be to persuade everyone that they can go back to normal, and should do so for the benefit of the economy. However Johnson apparently privately accepts that 50,000 a year will die from COVID as a result of this policy, something of an inconvenient truth.  I'd rather still be getting my medical advice from the likes of Sir Patrick Valance or Professor Chris Whitty rather than Sajid David or Rishi Sunak.

 

Definitely. Javid’s statement about not cowering from Covid was unbelievably lacking in empathy, understanding and knowledge of the disease.   The fact that he recovered rapidly himself ignores the potential horror of the disease for a very significant proportion of those who experience it, directly and indirectly. Of course there has to be a balance in moving forward but the attitude here now is basically move forward with no restrictions and hard luck if you get Covid. You should be alright as you are vaccinated but there are significant uncertainties. The impact of Long Covid on the economy is likely to be very serious due to people being unable to work and, as it says in the article that Betty linked, there is emerging evidence that Long Covid can occur after breakthrough infections. 

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1 hour ago, Betty LaRue said:

 

Cecile’s post is indicative of that. And I don’t believe she’s trying to scare people, but make them aware. If everyone is aware, maybe we can get a handle on this thing.

 

My point, exactly, Betty. 
I believe vaccination is crucial. I also believe it’s important to continue to practice the various safety measures.The new debate, as I see it, and as it affects me and those I love, is when, or if, the booster is necessary. 

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The vaccine was developed for the original strain and seemed to work well for that and a few minor variants that soon followed.  Then Delta came along with it’s horror show. That’s most likely why the huge upswing in cases is happening. The vaccine is less effective for it and as a result, more breakthrough cases. Add that to antibodies decreasing after a few months, and it’s not good. I do know of a few early breakthrough cases before Delta, but nothing like what we’re seeing now. We can’t stick our heads in the sand. Or close our eyes, cover our ears and sing, lalalalala.
It’s not going away easily.

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11 hours ago, Betty LaRue said:

The vaccine was developed for the original strain and seemed to work well for that and a few minor variants that soon followed.  Then Delta came along with it’s horror show. That’s most likely why the huge upswing in cases is happening. The vaccine is less effective for it and as a result, more breakthrough cases. Add that to antibodies decreasing after a few months, and it’s not good. I do know of a few early breakthrough cases before Delta, but nothing like what we’re seeing now. We can’t stick our heads in the sand. Or close our eyes, cover our ears and sing, lalalalala.
It’s not going away easily.

 

Yes. A little knowledge may be a dangerous thing but no knowledge at all is worse. 

 

I doubt there are too many people who would purposely go out and get Covid to protect themselves from Covid. That is a level of stupidity too far so I don't think we need to worry about that. The real danger is from the anti-vax and conspiracy theory stuff. I had someone tell me that Cristian Eriksen (Danish footballer) had had a heart attack on the field as a side effect of vaccination in a well-publicised event a few months back. He had actually had cardiac arrest due to what is probably a congenital condition. There have been so many reports now of people on their death beds wishing that they had not listened and had been vaccinated. Sure there are potential side effects from vaccines but these are statistically very minor in comparison to the potential effects of the disease.

 

Part of the reason for the higher number of breakthrough cases is simply that a lot more people are now vaccinated although your article is pretty clear on the lesser efficacy against Delta. In addition, the Delta variant is much more transmissible, believed to be due to very high viral loads in the early stages, even in asymptomatic and vaccinated individuals, as far as I have read. Hearing about direct experiences is extremely valuable as it brings home the seriousness of the disease - that is why I have related my own experiences with Long Covid here, not for sympathy. Covid can still seem remote to people who have never experienced it but is real and the effects can be devastating. Education is vital.

 

Edited by MDM
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13 hours ago, spacecadet said:
13 hours ago, MDM said:

It is vital that people be aware of the facts.

As long as they're not "alternative facts", preferably?

12 hours ago, MDM said:

.Science is a highly regarded journal so I don’t think that is a concern here. 

More of an observation on some of the transatlantic contributions here.

Sure, having had coronavirus gives a certain perspective, but there are others.

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Twenty years ago today, I sat over a cup of strong black coffee. The news had said an aircraft had crashed into the North Tower of the World Trade Center. How could that happen?, I thought. At 9:03 a second jet hit the South Tower. We’ve been attached, I thought. 

 

I was scheduled to work at People magazine that day. I figured it would take me 25 minutes to walk to the towers, but it would take less than that for the NY Cops to close the area. I left for my job.

 

On Lower Broadway, before going down into the Subway, I saw the fire in the towers and thought: how are they going to deal with that?

 

I ran into my friend Harvey Zucker also getting this (as it turned out) last train Uptown. Like me, Harvey had no answers. 

 

I had sworn long ago to never involve myself in anyway with another foreign war. But this was not a foreign war. This was my country, my city, my neighbours. When I got to the Time Life Building, I called the photo department and told them I had experience with this kind of thing and that they should give me one of their extra press IDs and let me go back Downtown. They said they’d call me back. When they did they told me they had issued all their IDs. At this point, both buildings had fallen. 

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I am so glad you were not there when they fell, Edo. Even long after the air was unhealthy around the pile. And you were living only a mile away. That whole area still feels creepy to me. Too many ghosts. And today we remember the people (mostly men)who went in to save people and the many who lost their lives while they went about their work on a beautiful fall day like today.

 

Paulette

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2 hours ago, Ed Rooney said:


Twenty years ago today, I sat over a cup of strong black coffee. The news had said an aircraft had crashed into the North Tower of the World Trade Center. How could that happen?, I thought. At 9:03 a second jet hit the South Tower. We’ve been attached, I thought. 

 

I was scheduled to work at People magazine that day. I figured it would take me 25 minutes to walk to the towers, but it would take less than that for the NY Cops to close the area. I left for my job.

 

On Lower Broadway, before going down into the Subway, I saw the fire in the towers and thought: how are they going to deal with that?

 

I ran into my friend Harvey Zucker also getting this (as it turned out) last train Uptown. Like me, Harvey had no answers. 

 

I had sworn long ago to never involve myself in anyway with another foreign war. But this was not a foreign war. This was my country, my city, my neighbours. When I got to the Time Life Building, I called the photo department and told them I had experience with this kind of thing and that they should give me one of their extra press IDs and let me go back Downtown. They said they’d call me back. When they did they told me they had issued all their IDs. At this point, both buildings had fallen. 

 

1 hour ago, NYCat said:

I am so glad you were not there when they fell, Edo. Even long after the air was unhealthy around the pile. And you were living only a mile away. That whole area still feels creepy to me. Too many ghosts. And today we remember the people (mostly men)who went in to save people and the many who lost their lives while they went about their work on a beautiful fall day like today.

 

Paulette

 

A terrible terrible thing to have happened and my heart went out on that day to all who died, their families and friends who remain, and to all those involved in the aftermath.

A harrowing experience.

 

Allan

 

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2 hours ago, NYCat said:

I am so glad you were not there when they fell, Edo. Even long after the air was unhealthy around the pile. And you were living only a mile away. That whole area still feels creepy to me. Too many ghosts. And today we remember the people (mostly men)who went in to save people and the many who lost their lives while they went about their work on a beautiful fall day like today.

 

Paulette

 

Closer to three miles, Paulette.

 

And I didn't consider going down to work on the piles; I have cough variant asthma. People did come from all over the nation to help with that. I remember talking to two firemen from Ohio sitting next to their fire car in SoHo. 

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4 minutes ago, Ed Rooney said:

 

Closer to three miles, Paulette.

 

And I didn't consider going down to work on the piles; I have cough variant asthma. People did come from all over the nation to help with that. I remember talking to two firemen from Ohio sitting next to their fire car in SoHo. 

 

So not on Mulberry Street then? You would have been in the "frozen zone" for a long time there. I was only frozen for a few days, I think, and only a six block walk to the soldiers stationed at 14th Street. I had a bone density test at Sloan-Kettering on the next day and a lot of the people working there had to walk a long way from lower Manhattan to a spot where the transportation was operating. it seemed nobody was staying home. People gathered everywhere. It was comforting.

 

Paulette

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Without my Time Warner ID, I could not have gotten home. As you said, I lived in the frozen zone. I had to walk home from Midtown, passing all the Eastside hospitals. Medics were standing around waiting to help the wounded. There were no wounded. It was a crazy time, but all that stuff was just inconveniences. We didn't have to jump out of the towers to escape the fires. And I didn't know anyone personally who was lost. 

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Have been stuck in near stationary traffic on A41 a few miles from M25 J20 due to XR protest. Now starting to move. Have camera ready and windows open in case there’s still a picture possibility. Could still become a good thing.

 

Edit- only exit from the J20 roundabout was clockwise onto the M25, past a row of police. Would have been unwise to have waved the RX100 out of the window.

Edited by sb photos
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  • 2 weeks later...
On 10/09/2021 at 19:35, Betty LaRue said:

Mark, information is gold. I want vaccinated people to be aware they aren’t bulletproof and to be as careful as the unvaccinated. My information isn’t anecdotal, but straight from this woman’s mouth. I’m not reported rumors, but facts. The facts as she told it.
 

If the vaccinated go about their affairs believing they are safe, don’t stay out of crowds, don’t mask, etc., they could get sick. I don’t want that. There is a real danger that both camps, vaccinated and unvaccinated, with mild cases or asymptotic, could be walking about infecting people.

Cecile’s post is indicative of that. And I don’t believe she’s trying to scare people, but make them aware. If everyone is aware, maybe we can get a handle on this thing.

 

 

Well I have just tested positive for Covid despite being doubly vaccinated and having had Covid before. I have a fever (which I didn't have the first time), pains In every part of my body and have near zero energy. So far my lungs are ok unlike round 1 when I had serious breathing problems although that could come on I guess as I am only a couple of days into this. I almost certainly got infected while photographing a wedding last Saturday - I had no choice but to fulfil my commitments to my clients even though I was well aware of the danger. 

 

So why post this on here? Well I am certainly not looking for sympathy.

 

No this is a direct warning from direct experience to those who are living under the illusion that the pandemic is over, as the great unmasked would have us believe. Yes it is definitely possible to get Covid if doubly vaccinated and it can be bad, very bad. There are those who argue that we have to get back to normal asap and pretend that the case rates are not going through the roof since restrictions in England were lifted (more so with the schools back) and that the UK had an average of 182 daily deaths from Covid over the last week. That is all very well for the 80% who will only experience relatively mild symptoms if anything. However, for the elderly, for those have weakened immune systems or other conditions that make them susceptible to developing serious or severe Covid (including long Covid) getting back to normal life is fraught with danger. 

 

I am not suggesting we live in permanent lockdown but there has to be a better middle road between that and removing all restrictions which propagates the illusion that all is normal. 

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17 minutes ago, MDM said:

pretend that the case rates are not going through the roof since restrictions in England were lifted (more so with the schools back)

But they're not AFAICS. They've dropped a third since July 19th and seem to have dipped a bit since the schools went back, even allowing for the timelag.

Edited by spacecadet
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30 minutes ago, MDM said:

 

Well I have just tested positive for Covid despite being doubly vaccinated and having had Covid before. I have a fever (which I didn't have the first time), pains In every part of my body and have near zero energy. So far my lungs are ok unlike round 1 when I had serious breathing problems although that could come on I guess as I am only a couple of days into this. I almost certainly got infected while photographing a wedding last Saturday - I had no choice but to fulfil my commitments to my clients even though I was well aware of the danger. 

 

So why post this on here? Well I am certainly not looking for sympathy.

 

No this is a direct warning from direct experience to those who are living under the illusion that the pandemic is over, as the great unmasked would have us believe. Yes it is definitely possible to get Covid if doubly vaccinated and it can be bad, very bad. There are those who argue that we have to get back to normal asap and pretend that the case rates are not going through the roof since restrictions in England were lifted (more so with the schools back) and that the UK had an average of 182 daily deaths from Covid over the last week. That is all very well for the 80% who will only experience relatively mild symptoms if anything. However, for the elderly, for those have weakened immune systems or other conditions that make them susceptible to developing serious or severe Covid (including long Covid) getting back to normal life is fraught with danger. 

 

I am not suggesting we live in permanent lockdown but there has to be a better middle road between that and removing all restrictions which propagates the illusion that all is normal. 

Sorry to hear that, but thanks for the warning. I hope you don't get it so badly this time, and that you make a good recovery. 

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6 minutes ago, VbFolly said:

Sorry to hear that, but thanks for the warning. I hope you don't get it so badly this time, and that you make a good recovery. 

 

Thank you.

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27 minutes ago, spacecadet said:

But they're not AFAICS. They've dropped a third since July 19th and seem to have dipped a bit since the schools went back, even allowing for the timelag.

 

OK you may be correct about case rates since July and give it another week or so for the schools. Forgive my error please - I am a little feverish right now. Case rates are difficult to measure as they are a function of testing (type of testing, numbers taking tests). The absence of restrictions means fewer people are legally obliged to take test which may be the real significator. Death rates from Covid, however, are a much more certain indicator and they have risen massively since July.

 

The bottom line is that the pandemic is not over and life is not going back to normal for a significant proportion of the population. 

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