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Vintage 35mm digitalized images


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Dear Alamy Contributors,

My wife and I are 'old school' photographers with 35,000 or so 35mm color slides using Nikon equipment and lens.  Most are Kodachrome 25 and 64.  We digitalized 1000s with the end result we have images with 150 to 250 megabits...too large to send by email.  Have any other ALAMY CONTRIBUTORS asked about submitting images in such large megabits and if so, what happened?  Also, there is an inherent loss of image fidelity between the original 35mm Kodachrome 25 and the digitalized results.  Any Contributors asked these questions? cheers, Flo and Paul

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Just now, KevinS said:

If it were me, I'd edit heavily and get the best ones (ones that show change) in through the archival route. If the subjects are American, getting them on sale soon would exploit the current booming economy here.  Maybe off-topic, but I'd spend some time adding keywords to your existing port. I took a quick look and found a photo of an isolated moose, but no way for a customer to fine it other than by location. Only takes seconds to add the word moose, and a scientific name would help as well. Similarly, a photo of a vintage vehicle in some weeds; no keyword saying vehicle, or type, etc.   

Your are reading our collective minds...We, too, are mulling over selecting the best of the best and re-scanning to JPEG as but a few to see what the end results look like compared to the original slide.  We are still learning from our first submissions to ALAMY and key wording.  We wait to see what happens when we apply for the VINTAGE route. cheers, Flo and Paul P.S. We have many many digital images from our NIKON D810 of Tombstone, Arizona; Sedona, AZ. Jerome, AZ, Grand Canyon El Tovar, Mount Rushmore, Hearst Castle and others plus a huge collection of agriculture/irrigation images of Arizona.

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A collection of 35,000 might edit down to more like a couple of thousand. I had 75,000 and only selected about 4,000. Back in film days I used to keep lots of alternatives but that is really not a suitable approach to digital conversion. If you are scanning Kodachromes, check very very carefully for secondary shadow or ghost outlines around things like twigs or rooflines. It's a special fault scanning those emulsions. My Nikon LS 9000 had a special mode for Kodachrome which mostly solved the problem. It is a slow process, just take your time. Chances are, your files will just about pass QC but there may well be a few fails. By all means ask for archival status.

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17 minutes ago, Robert M Estall said:

A collection of 35,000 might edit down to more like a couple of thousand. I had 75,000 and only selected about 4,000. Back in film days I used to keep lots of alternatives but that is really not a suitable approach to digital conversion. If you are scanning Kodachromes, check very very carefully for secondary shadow or ghost outlines around things like twigs or rooflines. It's a special fault scanning those emulsions. My Nikon LS 9000 had a special mode for Kodachrome which mostly solved the problem. It is a slow process, just take your time. Chances are, your files will just about pass QC but there may well be a few fails. By all means ask for archival status.

"Dear Robert, thank you for taking time to make an excellent recommendation.  We truly dread buying more equipment and the huge amount of time to re-do 1000s of slides that, in the end, may not cut the mustard.   We will first give ALAMY's 'archival' option a chance as we already have 100s of dual-layer disk with TIFF images on-board.  Again, our thanks.  Flo and Paul

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2 hours ago, Old school said:

"Dear Robert, thank you for taking time to make an excellent recommendation.  We truly dread buying more equipment and the huge amount of time to re-do 1000s of slides that, in the end, may not cut the mustard.   We will first give ALAMY's 'archival' option a chance as we already have 100s of dual-layer disk with TIFF images on-board.  Again, our thanks.  Flo and Paul

 

You have mentioned 100s of dual-layer disks a few times. I am just wondering if you were advised to use DVDs? If so I think that is likely to have been bad advice. That is a very expensive, inefficient and ultimately unwise way to store an archive of images. Hard drives are much cheaper nowadays than DVDs, are much faster to transfer data to and are likely to be more reliable as an archiving medium - better to buy a new drive or drives every few years and redo the backup. Cloud storage may be preferable in the long run. Also you are almost certainly wasting a lot of space saving as TIFF given that the scans are sub-standard in the first place. Much better to write them back out as JPEGs and store them. They would need to be JPEGs for Alamy anyway as far as I know.

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1 hour ago, MDM said:

 

You have mentioned 100s of dual-layer disks a few times. I am just wondering if you were advised to use DVDs? If so I think that is likely to have been bad advice. That is a very expensive, inefficient and ultimately unwise way to store an archive of images. Hard drives are much cheaper nowadays than DVDs, are much faster to transfer data to and are likely to be more reliable as an archiving medium - better to buy a new drive or drives every few years and redo the backup. Cloud storage may be preferable in the long run. Also you are almost certainly wasting a lot of space saving as TIFF given that the scans are sub-standard in the first place. Much better to write them back out as JPEGs and store them. They would need to be JPEGs for Alamy anyway as far as I know.

Hi robert,

We thank you once again for your insight on our challenge.  We decided to use a MEMOREX DVD+R DUAL LAYER 8.5GB UNFORMATTED.  When formatted, we get about 7.9GB of storage.  Our TIFF images have been between 150-250 MB each.  Each disk will hold about 40-images.  We have perhaps 400 of these disk.  We have already gobbled-up 3 TB of storage in our original computer and bought an additional 4-TB of storage.  We also bought WESTERN DIGITAL's MY DUO STORAGE at 20 TB; when formatted, it gave us 9.6 TB for a paired storage unit.

Once we apply for the VINTAGE program at ALAMY, we'll know more of just how big a problem we have in trying to use the existing images without using our PACIFIC scanner to re-do selected groups of images to JPEG.  It took us years to scanned the images we did scan.  Again, our thanks.  We also thank all ALAMY CONTRIBUTORS who took the time to help us.

Cheers, Flo and Paul

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5 hours ago, Robert M Estall said:

 

A collection of 35,000 might edit down to more like a couple of thousand. I had 75,000 and only selected about 4,000.

 

 

When I joined Alamy I bought a Coolscan 5000 with plans to scan my 30,000 or so (maybe 15,000 saleable). In the end I managed to find just 420 good enough for Alamy. I don't regret buying the scanner because it was when they were affordable and I didn't have any decent digital copies of any of my images, but it was certainly a shock to find that they wouldn't cut the mustard, including many that had sold over the years. The archival route wasn't available then, so if I can ever be bothered I may have a go at that one day.

 

Alan

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12 minutes ago, Inchiquin said:

 

When I joined Alamy I bought a Coolscan 5000 with plans to scan my 30,000 or so (maybe 15,000 saleable). In the end I managed to find just 420 good enough for Alamy. I don't regret buying the scanner because it was when they were affordable and I didn't have any decent digital copies of any of my images, but it was certainly a shock to find that they wouldn't cut the mustard, including many that had sold over the years. The archival route wasn't available then, so if I can ever be bothered I may have a go at that one day.

 

Alan

After reading all of ALAMY's contributors to offered their own efforts to 'use' 35 mm slides, Flo and I come to the conclusion that if the VINTAGE opportunities work, we will avoid substantial costs and much labor.  Nevertheless, there are 35,000 or so slides sitting in our closet saying, "Scan us." and those soft voices are tugging at our sleeves.  Cheers, Flo and Paul

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25 minutes ago, Old school said:

Hi robert,

We thank you once again for your insight on our challenge.  We decided to use a MEMOREX DVD+R DUAL LAYER 8.5GB UNFORMATTED.  When formatted, we get about 7.9GB of storage.  Our TIFF images have been between 150-250 MB each.  Each disk will hold about 40-images.  We have perhaps 400 of these disk.  We have already gobbled-up 3 TB of storage in our original computer and bought an additional 4-TB of storage.  We also bought WESTERN DIGITAL's MY DUO STORAGE at 20 TB; when formatted, it gave us 9.6 TB for a paired storage unit.

Once we apply for the VINTAGE program at ALAMY, we'll know more of just how big a problem we have in trying to use the existing images without using our PACIFIC scanner to re-do selected groups of images to JPEG.  It took us years to scanned the images we did scan.  Again, our thanks.  We also thank all ALAMY CONTRIBUTORS who took the time to help us.

Cheers, Flo and Paul

 

Ok it was me (MDM - Michael) not Robert that made that last comment. What I am wondering is why you are storing on DVDs at all as it would be far cheaper to store on 4 or 8TB hard drives as well as the fact that DVDs can degrade quite rapidly. I was wondering did you get some advice to use DVDs - this would have been normal back in the early 2000s but in recent years hard drives represent much cheaper and stable storage. 

 

I am politely guessing that your understanding of the digital process in general may be lacking in some ways (given some things you have said above and your user name of Old school. You do not need to rescan to JPEG, you simply need to convert the TIFF files to JPEG if they are of adequate quality. This is done on the computer, no need to rescan unless the TIFFimages are not good enough. You won't be able to submit TIFF files on DVDs to Alamy as far as I know, they require JPEGs.

 

 

 

 

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38 minutes ago, Old school said:

Hi robert,

We thank you once again for your insight on our challenge.  We decided to use a MEMOREX DVD+R DUAL LAYER 8.5GB UNFORMATTED.  When formatted, we get about 7.9GB of storage.  Our TIFF images have been between 150-250 MB each.  Each disk will hold about 40-images.  We have perhaps 400 of these disk.  We have already gobbled-up 3 TB of storage in our original computer and bought an additional 4-TB of storage.  We also bought WESTERN DIGITAL's MY DUO STORAGE at 20 TB; when formatted, it gave us 9.6 TB for a paired storage unit.

Once we apply for the VINTAGE program at ALAMY, we'll know more of just how big a problem we have in trying to use the existing images without using our PACIFIC scanner to re-do selected groups of images to JPEG.  It took us years to scanned the images we did scan.  Again, our thanks.  We also thank all ALAMY CONTRIBUTORS who took the time to help us.

Cheers, Flo and Paul

In the UK USB drives are about 8c per GB. DVDs seem to be about 4c. Not much advantage. It's not a particularly efficient form of storage nowadays.

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16 minutes ago, MDM said:

 

Ok it was me (MDM - Michael) not Robert that made that last comment. What I am wondering is why you are storing on DVDs at all as it would be far cheaper to store on 4 or 8TB hard drives as well as the fact that DVDs can degrade quite rapidly. I was wondering did you get some advice to use DVDs - this would have been normal back in the early 2000s but in recent years hard drives represent much cheaper and stable storage. 

 

I am politely guessing that your understanding of the digital process in general may be lacking in some ways (given some things you have said above and your user name of Old school. You do not need to rescan to JPEG, you simply need to convert the TIFF files to JPEG if they are of adequate quality. This is done on the computer, no need to rescan unless the TIFFimages are not good enough. You won't be able to submit TIFF files on DVDs to Alamy as far as I know, they require JPEGs.

 

 

 

 

You observation about our skill sets in manipulating our images is correct...that is one of the primary reasons we posed the question to ALAMY contributor.  You are the first to note we can 'convert the TIFF to JPEG...there inlies the rub...we haven't the foggiest idea how to do that.  As we have noted in previous posts, our computer outwits us on a regular bases.  Does this 'method' to 'convert' on some type of 'converting TIFF to JPEG for Dummies' available?  And if so, where can we find it?  Again, our thanks. Flo and Paul

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8 minutes ago, spacecadet said:

In the UK USB drives are about 8c per GB. DVDs seem to be about 4c. Not much advantage. It's not a particularly efficient form of storage nowadays.

A 4TB portable WD drive is £82 in PC World right now which makes about 2 pence per GB whereas a set of 100 DVDs is £30 which makes about 6 pence per GB so hard drives are around 1/3 of the price. The dollar conversion would give a similar difference. GIven the significant extra work involved in writing off DVDs and their unreliability as medium or long term storage media, they would certainly not be my choice. 

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4 minutes ago, Old school said:

You observation about our skill sets in manipulating our images is correct...that is one of the primary reasons we posed the question to ALAMY contributor.  You are the first to note we can 'convert the TIFF to JPEG...there inlies the rub...we haven't the foggiest idea how to do that.  As we have noted in previous posts, our computer outwits us on a regular bases.  Does this 'method' to 'convert' on some type of 'converting TIFF to JPEG for Dummies' available?  And if so, where can we find it?  Again, our thanks. Flo and Paul

 

I do think you need to start at the basics. It's a shame you didn't get advice before doing all that work. What type of computer are you using - PC or Mac?

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Just now, MDM said:

 

I do think you need to start at the basics. It's a shame you didn't get advice before doing all that work. What type of computer are you using - PC or Mac?

Aah. 'Tis the bane of being a senior citizen...perfect 20-20 hindsight. Our computer is a personal computer PC

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8 minutes ago, MDM said:

A 4TB portable WD drive is £82 in PC World right now which makes about 2 pence per GB whereas a set of 100 DVDs is £30 which makes about 6 pence per GB so hard drives are around 1/3 of the price. The dollar conversion would give a similar difference. GIven the significant extra work involved in writing off DVDs and their unreliability as medium or long term storage media, they would certainly not be my choice. 

Our original plan was to submit the TIFF images as part of a short-story we wrote.  We did this for years using slides.  so, we used disks versus hard drive storage...we only use that form of storage for security of our images if our computer's hard drive fails or is hacked.  Later, we bought the Western Digital MY DUO to store images outside of our computer for security reasons.

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37 minutes ago, Old school said:

Aah. 'Tis the bane of being a senior citizen...perfect 20-20 hindsight. Our computer is a personal computer PC

 

I take it then that the images you have on Alamy are jpegs straight from the camera with no editing? They appear to be as they are all the same size -103.4 MB which is the size of an image from a D810.

 

Not sure what to suggest but I think you need to get some basic but decent software for image editing (Photoshop Elements or Affinity Photo perhaps) and start from scratch with basic editing - opening, cropping, modifying and saving files for starters. You would need to check that your computer is compatible with whatever software you decide to use. There is probably a basic image editor on your PC - I am a Mac user so maybe somebody else could advise. 

 

The basics are not difficult. If you learn well from books then there are loads of beginner books out there. Otherwise a beginner course, either hands-on or online would be a good idea. 

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1 hour ago, Old school said:

 

 Does this 'method' to 'convert' on some type of 'converting TIFF to JPEG for Dummies' available?

 

 

All you need to do is load the TIFF into a photo editor and save it out again as a JPEG. Nothing more than that. I would think any photo editor, including free ones, will do that. The options for saving will include a quality setting. As long as you choose high quality you can't go wrong.

 

Alan

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Steady on, that's assuming that the 16-bit tiff is anywhere near optimised, that's pretty unlikely I would think. Once it's saved to jpeg the options for getting a good result once sufficient knowledge of available software has been gained is compromised. The impression I'm getting is that this Pacific scanner has been left to do its work and the resultng 16-bit tiffs burnt straight to these dual layer DVDs with no intervention.

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Can we respectfully ask Old School to learn the basics of digital photography? This is a tough one! I know how it feels when you're surrounded by people who have mastered a technique that I never could grasp, but still, there are times when we have to do some studying. In the States, most community colleges have digital photography courses that go over this stuff - I've taught one or two of them myself.

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1 hour ago, Brian Yarvin said:

Can we respectfully ask Old School to learn the basics of digital photography? This is a tough one! I know how it feels when you're surrounded by people who have mastered a technique that I never could grasp, but still, there are times when we have to do some studying. In the States, most community colleges have digital photography courses that go over this stuff - I've taught one or two of them myself.

It is easier than taking a class, buy books, I have a stack of them going back to PS 3, still only one for Lightroom, but that will change.

If you want to license images, you will need to make digital images that people need and can not just make on their own.

Also I do not believe that the Pacific Image scanner is very good, but it is what you have.

 

P.S. I have 20 WD 1TB external drives sitting above my desk and by this time next year it will be over 30.  They are cheap to buy online and I

keep it to 1TB because if one fails I am not at a total loss.  I've had more drive failures with my internal drives then I've had with WD externals.

 

Chuck

Edited by Chuck Nacke
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Chuck, sometimes a class will help because it's possible to question the instructor. If you've got the vocabulary wrong, a book will leave you lost - you'll be searching for the wrong thing. Good teachers can get you on the right track quickly.

 

And ... I'm not the guy with the Pacific Image Scanner. Indeed, I don't own any scanner at all these days. 

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2 hours ago, Harry Harrison said:

Steady on, that's assuming that the 16-bit tiff is anywhere near optimised, that's pretty unlikely I would think. Once it's saved to jpeg the options for getting a good result once sufficient knowledge of available software has been gained is compromised. The impression I'm getting is that this Pacific scanner has been left to do its work and the resultng 16-bit tiffs burnt straight to these dual layer DVDs with no intervention.

 

I was only answering the specific question about how to convert TIFF to JPEG. Editing is another matter entirely and given what Paul has told us, I think it would be beyond his level of expertise just now, without some further study as suggested by others.

 

Alan

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6 hours ago, Brian Yarvin said:

Chuck, sometimes a class will help because it's possible to question the instructor. If you've got the vocabulary wrong, a book will leave you lost - you'll be searching for the wrong thing. Good teachers can get you on the right track quickly.

 

And ... I'm not the guy with the Pacific Image Scanner. Indeed, I don't own any scanner at all these days. 

Brian,

 

Did not mean to put you down in any way.  I've just had to learn from books and Google.  Wish I had the time to sit in a class and I am sure

yours are worth sitting in.

 

I never meant to infer you were working with a "Pacific Image Scanner."

 

FYI Brian,  If you have a minute could you please take a look at my most recent images from the Hermitage.  They were shot on RDP at

+1 and were scanned with a CanoScan FS4000US using VueScan as 16bit TIFF's before dropping to 8bit JPEG's.  Most of these were

single pass, but the White Hall is from a 3 Pass, all were done without IR or Noise Reduction.

 

Thanks,

 

Chuck

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3 minutes ago, Brian Yarvin said:

Chuck, why did you use film in this case? It looks like one of those situations where digital would be exponentially easier.

I don't think they're recent images.

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3 hours ago, Brian Yarvin said:

Chuck, why did you use film in this case? It looks like one of those situations where digital would be exponentially easier.

Brian,

 

Because Film was all I had in 1994.

 

Chuck

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