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I don't bother helping because:

 

1. None of them seem like they know how to take photographs

2. They all sound like high school students

3. The all seem to come from microstock (you can see their image captions and tags and it's immediately obvious)

4. I don't want people as such here, so I don't want to encourage them

 

I wouldn't expect someone else to teach me their trade so I would compete against them so why should I do the same.  

Perhaps I'm mean, but I like to deal with serious people when it comes to professions.  Maybe that's why I see so many incompetent people in their daily jobs.

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Am I being a curmudgeon for feeling worn slick?

 

 

Not at all! You're one of the most generous person in this forum!

 

As a newby myself (I've been in Alamy for more than a year but still consider myself as a newby) I find extremely helpful all the information in the differents posts and threads, and I spend several hours a week just reading and learning. And I'm usuallly surprised of finding the sames questions again and again and the time that many of you takes for answer them. 

 

As you say, we have to do the work for ourselves! It's called researching. And it's key for any new job that one is about to undertake. (but I think that many new comers don't see it as a job)

 

Anyway, I take this opportunity to thank all of you so much for the help and time that you dedicate to other people like me  :)

 

 

(sorry for my english... spanish is my first language so struggling a bit here)

 

 

Thank you for your appreciation. One of the things that has discouraged me from helping is the many times we receive no thanks or any feedback at all about whether our efforts are appreciated.

 

Paulette

 

 

Believe me, they are really appreciated!  :)

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I don't bother helping because:

 

1. None of them seem like they know how to take photographs

2. They all sound like high school students

3. The all seem to come from microstock (you can see their image captions and tags and it's immediately obvious)

4. I don't want people as such here, so I don't want to encourage them

 

I wouldn't expect someone else to teach me their trade so I would compete against them so why should I do the same.  

Perhaps I'm mean, but I like to deal with serious people when it comes to professions.  Maybe that's why I see so many incompetent people in their daily jobs.

 

Hmmmm.... i always have a feeling that microstocks are much more critical with accepting images. Try to submit an out of composition image. Rejection will be standard. The same for technical issues. Maybe they come from microstock because to many images are rejected there. I see often underexposed or images with bad composition here. They would be never accepted on microstock. So point number 3 is absolutely not valid. 

 

I dont mind people here asking about stock photography and therefore Alamy. When it comes to questions about photography and its basics then i agree with you all. Its like buying a horse and riders clothes, participating in a riding competition and then asking other riders how to ride the animal.

 

Mirco

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I don't bother helping because:

 

1. None of them seem like they know how to take photographs

2. They all sound like high school students

3. The all seem to come from microstock (you can see their image captions and tags and it's immediately obvious)

4. I don't want people as such here, so I don't want to encourage them

 

I wouldn't expect someone else to teach me their trade so I would compete against them so why should I do the same.  

Perhaps I'm mean, but I like to deal with serious people when it comes to professions.  Maybe that's why I see so many incompetent people in their daily jobs.

 

Hmmmm.... i always have a feeling that microstocks are much more critical with accepting images. Try to submit an out of composition image. Rejection will be standard. The same for technical issues. Maybe they come from microstock because to many images are rejected there. I see often underexposed or images with bad composition here. They would be never accepted on microstock. So point number 3 is absolutely not valid. 

 

I dont mind people here asking about stock photography and therefore Alamy. When it comes to questions about photography and its basics then i agree with you all. Its like buying a horse and riders clothes, participating in a riding competition and then asking other riders how to ride the animal.

 

Mirco

 

 

I never said that because they come from microstock they don't know how to take pictures. 

 

But you said it yourself "Maybe they come from microstock because too many images are rejected there" proving that they don't know squat about photography.  So you are basically saying that we get microstock rejects here, so then even moreso I wouldn't want to help them.  They should go to photography school first and then spend at least 10 years practicing.

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I don't bother helping because:

 

1. None of them seem like they know how to take photographs

2. They all sound like high school students

3. The all seem to come from microstock (you can see their image captions and tags and it's immediately obvious)

4. I don't want people as such here, so I don't want to encourage them

 

I wouldn't expect someone else to teach me their trade so I would compete against them so why should I do the same.  

Perhaps I'm mean, but I like to deal with serious people when it comes to professions.  Maybe that's why I see so many incompetent people in their daily jobs.

 

Hmmmm.... i always have a feeling that microstocks are much more critical with accepting images. Try to submit an out of composition image. Rejection will be standard. The same for technical issues. Maybe they come from microstock because to many images are rejected there. I see often underexposed or images with bad composition here. They would be never accepted on microstock. So point number 3 is absolutely not valid. 

 

I dont mind people here asking about stock photography and therefore Alamy. When it comes to questions about photography and its basics then i agree with you all. Its like buying a horse and riders clothes, participating in a riding competition and then asking other riders how to ride the animal.

 

Mirco

 

 

I never said that because they come from microstock they don't know how to take pictures. 

 

But you said it yourself "Maybe they come from microstock because too many images are rejected there" proving that they don't know squat about photography.  So you are basically saying that we get microstock rejects here, so then even moreso I wouldn't want to help them.  They should go to photography school first and then spend at least 10 years practicing.

 

 

Lots of failures in microstock are due to subject, not comnpositon.  Subjects that are saturated are quite often rejected as they simply don't want any more.

 

Jill

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I don't know what you all think, but it seems a lot of new people are moving to Alamy.

 

As a result, we see them asking the same questions over and over. I've always tried to answer newbie questions to the best of my ability, but lately, because there's so many newbie questions that a simple search of the forums would answer, I find myself deciding "if they won't spend the time searching, why should I devote valuable time answering?" How do you feel about it?

 

Exceptions, of course, to the more unique questions that are not found easily. I still want to help on those, but usually my more savvy friends here are better suited.

 

I think a newbie needs to spend an hour or two every evening just reading threads for a week. Grab a drink of their choice and settle in. There is so much useful information available in these threads. But a few don't want to do that. They'd rather spend 60 seconds asking how tos, whats, and such. Putting the onus on everyone else.

 

This is the best group of photographers I've ever seen. Helpful and giving of themselves. It would be nice if newbies at least tried to help themselves first.

Am I being a curmudgeon for feeling worn slick?

Betty

 

I have been taking the same view for the last year at least. If they won't search or show that they have basic, professional level, photography skills and understanding I ignore them. Especially when they expect support before they have added any value to the forums themselves.

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just refer to the newbies to member services - unless they can demonstrate they have undertaken certain pre work themselves as Betty states 

If alamy want new RF micro contributors then with that comes an obligation to help them

Not in my contract

When i was a newbie here - i read and read and read

I wasn't lazy in posting sloppy questions 

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I don't know what you all think, but it seems a lot of new people are moving to Alamy.

 

As a result, we see them asking the same questions over and over. I've always tried to answer newbie questions to the best of my ability, but lately, because there's so many newbie questions that a simple search of the forums would answer, I find myself deciding "if they won't spend the time searching, why should I devote valuable time answering?" How do you feel about it?

 

Exceptions, of course, to the more unique questions that are not found easily. I still want to help on those, but usually my more savvy friends here are better suited.

 

I think a newbie needs to spend an hour or two every evening just reading threads for a week. Grab a drink of their choice and settle in. There is so much useful information available in these threads. But a few don't want to do that. They'd rather spend 60 seconds asking how tos, whats, and such. Putting the onus on everyone else.

 

This is the best group of photographers I've ever seen. Helpful and giving of themselves. It would be nice if newbies at least tried to help themselves first.

Am I being a curmudgeon for feeling worn slick?

Betty

I think you're right and not being curmudgeonly at all, although, I don't think it's people asking the same questions is what bothers me. I like others didn't discover the forum for a while & sometimes the threads can be difficult to follow, so I understand people asking questions and sometimes it is easier to ask a question and get a quicker response to a question.

 

But the problem for me is the advertising, blogging, tweeting etc As this seems to be bringing people who have no idea of the very basics of Photography and the constant same question about "my images haven't passed...I'm using a 1 gig Nokia phone...surely that's enough?...it looks crystal clear on my screen", type questions are the ones that bother me. I thought about joining Alamy for a long time, thinking I knew nothing about resolution, sharpness etc before putting my first four photos in, but in comparison, I was a genius compared to some people who are joining now.

 

There is tons of information about photography out there compared to when I started and as you say, most people do answer with incredible patience, so whilst I understand people need to learn and might not know much, I really don't understand how you can not know the basics of Photography, resolution, size etc. but then sign up to what is in effect a professional stock photographic agency and think your images will be good enough for news, books TV etc? its all a bit beyond me.

 

I suppose the S....imo word might have something to do with it too, but Facebook, Twitter, Instagram modern camera phones has made everyone think they are photographers when they are clearly not.

 

I wonder if when they pass their driving test, do they think they can drive the F1 at Monaco and have a chance of winning?

Chris

 

I agree entirely. So many people now can take photographs with camera's that are very forgiving. The images look good and when posted on various social media sites they receive favourable comments. In my opinion, though this does not make them photographers, not when we are working in a professional format.

 

I am not saying that only professionals should be marketing on Alamy but a good degree of knowledge is required in order to work in and satisfy our customers.

 

I worked as a photographer for over 45 years I was and still am happy to offer any advice and help to anybody interested in photography. My interest in photography goes back to my boyhood and I still love it as much today.

 

This is and never was a get rich quick scheme, certainly not now. You need to put in the work and be aware of what is going on in stock. So often I have seen people complain that nothing has sold when they only 100 images up. You have to be in for the long haul and be patient.

But most of all you have to love it.

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I often help newbies and other more experienced contributors do too, and it's always the same few who try to help. Sometimes it's annoying when they obviously don't have any idea what they're doing, and sometimes I ignore them too, depending how their first post comes across. I often still give a bit of help though to point them in the right direction. I really don't like the unfriendly atmosphere some old-timers create, just because they know all there is to know and have been doing it for decades, and they sit on their high horse putting down everyone who is new and needs guidance. I see this in other forums too about other subjects, where people are new (sometimes I'm the new one) and they struggle to understand the basics, and if anyone dares ask a question they get hounded by lots of rude bullies who criticise. Sometimes when you're new it's hard to understand what's obvious to people who have been doing it a while, and it's hard knowing what's a silly question and what isn't. It's a bit like a club of people who push outsiders away rather than welcoming them and giving up a bit of time to help them out. I gave up on the Facebook group for Alamy due to the unfriendly atmosphere and the way every single one of my posts were ignored, yet others who had been there a long time and posted similar comments would receive responses and would chat together. I felt like I was intruding, so I left. I don't want those who are new here feeling pushed out like that.

 

I'm sure many will dislike this post but after reading some responses above I had to speak up.

 

Geoff.

I usually refrain from commenting on newbie questions as I would come over as an 'unfriendly old-timer'.

I would happily answer questions about Alamy, but not the basic questions we continually see about actual photography.

The people who got a camera for Christmas and arrive here because their mates say they are the next David Bailey would be better served on a 'photography' forum first.

I am fairly new to stock, but have been shooting for many years and did the usual Weddings/Christenings etc back in the 80's (and hated it), but certainly don't think I know it all.

Edited to add: In the real world, I would help anyone out, including novice photographers, but this is not the real world.

The people who should really be answering questions here are... ALAMY!

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I usually refrain from commenting on newbie questions as I would come over as an 'unfriendly old-timer'.

I would happily answer questions about Alamy, but not the basic questions we continually see about actual photography.

The people who got a camera for Christmas and arrive here because their mates say they are the next David Bailey would be better served on a 'photography' forum first.

I am fairly new to stock, but have been shooting for many years and did the usual Weddings/Christenings etc back in the 80's (and hated it), but certainly don't think I know it all.

 

The people who should really be answering questions here are... ALAMY!

 

 

Yes I agree with that. I think you're right that it's sometimes better not to comment in case you come across unfriendly. I probably give too much basic photography help at times, and it is frustrating when the advice isn't listened to.

 

Geoff.

 

I agree with both of you, as Betty originally said, nothing wrong with helping anyone new, but some of the questions about camera type, resolution & "why have my images failed", can all be relatively good questions, but as consider myself a relative newcomer to the forum, I haven't advised, but some questions have felt so daft, (or argumentative) even when they have been told the right answer, I have wondered if they were actually pretending to have no knowledge!

Chris

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This is a very interesting thread. I'm glad I started it. What makes it important is the newbies who are reading it, the ones who are inclined to ask without attempting to find answers for themselves, just might have a lightbulb turn on in their heads. A definite learning experience.

And the ones reading this who have done it right, can feel satisfied that they have done it right.

Maybe we need to bump this thread every month or two. :D

Betty

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This is a very interesting thread. I'm glad I started it. What makes it important is the newbies who are reading it, the ones who are inclined to ask without attempting to find answers for themselves, just might have a lightbulb turn on in their heads. A definite learning experience.

And the ones reading this who have done it right, can feel satisfied that they have done it right.

Maybe we need to bump this thread every month or two. :D

Betty

Betty, it's all right.
But I think with regard to everyone, and the statement that the century live, learn a century - still a fool will die.
Therefore, any gained experience is more valuable than investing in equipment.
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Whilst I trying to explain the effects of lens diffraction at small apertures to a fellow photographer, I came across this website http://www.cambridgeincolour.com/

 

It's got some really well illustrated and clear guidance on the basics. It could be worth referring new contributors here. I've bookmarked it for future reference. :)

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I often help newbies and other more experienced contributors do too, and it's always the same few who try to help. Sometimes it's annoying when they obviously don't have any idea what they're doing, and sometimes I ignore them too, depending how their first post comes across. I often still give a bit of help though to point them in the right direction. I really don't like the unfriendly atmosphere some old-timers create, just because they know all there is to know and have been doing it for decades, and they sit on their high horse putting down everyone who is new and needs guidance. I see this in other forums too about other subjects, where people are new (sometimes I'm the new one) and they struggle to understand the basics, and if anyone dares ask a question they get hounded by lots of rude bullies who criticise. Sometimes when you're new it's hard to understand what's obvious to people who have been doing it a while, and it's hard knowing what's a silly question and what isn't. It's a bit like a club of people who push outsiders away rather than welcoming them and giving up a bit of time to help them out. I gave up on the Facebook group for Alamy due to the unfriendly atmosphere and the way every single one of my posts were ignored, yet others who had been there a long time and posted similar comments would receive responses and would chat together. I felt like I was intruding, so I left. I don't want those who are new here feeling pushed out like that.

 

I'm sure many will dislike this post but after reading some responses above I had to speak up.

 

Geoff.

Well said Geoff. Although not a real newbie I have only recently started to take Alamy seriously and you were one of the people who responded with good advice recently which I very much appreciated. I am trying very hard to put your and several other people's advice into practice as I am serious about making a (limited) success on Alamy. 

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Whilst I trying to explain the effects of lens diffraction at small apertures to a fellow photographer, I came across this website http://www.cambridgeincolour.com/

 

It's got some really well illustrated and clear guidance on the basics. It could be worth referring new contributors here. I've bookmarked it for future reference. :)

Don't want to be blunt (though "blunt" is my middle name, I guess <_<) but if you have to explain the basics of photography HERE, then surely a stock agency isn't the place to be for those guys. It's like buying a hammer, a saw and a few nails and immediately thinking about selling furniture. Shouldn't one take time to master the craft FIRST? And when it seems you're GOOD at it ........ only then ....... think about selling? :huh:

 

Cheers,

Philippe

 

 

I agree with your points but was simply pointing out an excellent resource that "newbies" could be referred to. This could save having to keep explaining some of the the basics here.

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Whilst I trying to explain the effects of lens diffraction at small apertures to a fellow photographer, I came across this website http://www.cambridgeincolour.com/

 

It's got some really well illustrated and clear guidance on the basics. It could be worth referring new contributors here. I've bookmarked it for future reference. :)

Don't want to be blunt (though "blunt" is my middle name, I guess <_<) but if you have to explain the basics of photography HERE, then surely a stock agency isn't the place to be for those guys. It's like buying a hammer, a saw and a few nails and immediately thinking about selling furniture. Shouldn't one take time to master the craft FIRST? And when it seems you're GOOD at it ........ only then ....... think about selling? :huh:

 

Cheers,

Philippe

 

 

I agree with your points but was simply pointing out an excellent resource that "newbies" could be referred to. This could save having to keep explaining some of the the basics here.

 

 

But why would we be referring them to that page????  They shouldn't be here if they must be referred to that page!  No one said that we must explain photography basics to anyone.  If this would be on learning photography forum I would be all for it.

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Whilst I trying to explain the effects of lens diffraction at small apertures to a fellow photographer, I came across this website http://www.cambridgeincolour.com/

 

It's got some really well illustrated and clear guidance on the basics. It could be worth referring new contributors here. I've bookmarked it for future reference. :)

Don't want to be blunt (though "blunt" is my middle name, I guess <_<) but if you have to explain the basics of photography HERE, then surely a stock agency isn't the place to be for those guys. It's like buying a hammer, a saw and a few nails and immediately thinking about selling furniture. Shouldn't one take time to master the craft FIRST? And when it seems you're GOOD at it ........ only then ....... think about selling? :huh:

 

Cheers,

Philippe

 

 

I agree with your points but was simply pointing out an excellent resource that "newbies" could be referred to. This could save having to keep explaining some of the the basics here.

 

 

But why would we be referring them to that page????  They shouldn't be here if they must be referred to that page!  No one said that we must explain photography basics to anyone.  If this would be on learning photography forum I would be all for it.

 

 

so lets put it all into practice - you only get help if you can demonstrate you have already put in the hard yards and made an effort to help yourself first

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It seems pretty likely that a lot of newbies with little knowledge of the craft of photography are attracted by Alamy's blurb on the contributor homepage. There is no mention of a need to produce professional quality pictures. It is not until one gets to the submission guidelines that there is any mention of reasons for failure and there is no longer a list of suitable cameras - just a mention of DSLR or equivalent camera which is very vague.

 

It is no surprise really to see camera owners thinking they are photographers by virtue of the fact that they own a decent camera (or even a good smartphone), as the bar has been lowered very significantly in terms of how one would define a professional quality picture in the world of digital media (i.e. a picture suitable for publication on a professional website).

 

Let's face it - photography skills are generally much less appreciated these days. I was speaking to a builder last week who had just fitted a very nice bathroom and was telling me it wasn't possible to get a photo because the space was too small. I told him that it would be no problem to me to do it and then I told him how I would do it: take several shots and merge. The lights came on and he decided he could do it himself with his phone camera which has a panorama facility. I did try to explain that I could do a far better job using a tripod, DSLR and merge on a computer but he wasn't interested. The point is that quality photography is appreciated less and less - the DIY job is sufficient. Of course I did tell him that I would be fitting my own new bathroom and would not require his services as I am now a builder with my new screwdrivers, hammer, saw and drill (not really - the consequences would be unimaginable).

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It seems pretty likely that a lot of newbies with little knowledge of the craft of photography are attracted by Alamy's blurb on the contributor homepage. There is no mention of a need to produce professional quality pictures. It is not until one gets to the submission guidelines that there is any mention of reasons for failure and there is no longer a list of suitable cameras - just a mention of DSLR or equivalent camera which is very vague.

 

It is no surprise really to see camera owners thinking they are photographers by virtue of the fact that they own a decent camera (or even a good smartphone), as the bar has been lowered very significantly in terms of how one would define a professional quality picture in the world of digital media (i.e. a picture suitable for publication on a professional website).

 

Let's face it - photography skills are generally much less appreciated these days. I was speaking to a builder last week who had just fitted a very nice bathroom and was telling me it wasn't possible to get a photo because the space was too small. I told him that it would be no problem to me to do it and then I told him how I would do it: take several shots and merge. The lights came on and he decided he could do it himself with his phone camera which has a panorama facility. I did try to explain that I could do a far better job using a tripod, DSLR and merge on a computer but he wasn't interested. The point is that quality photography is appreciated less and less - the DIY job is sufficient. Of course I did tell him that I would be fitting my own new bathroom and would not require his services as I am now a builder with my new screwdrivers, hammer, saw and drill (not really - the consequences would be unimaginable).

 

:D
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It seems pretty likely that a lot of newbies with little knowledge of the craft of photography are attracted by Alamy's blurb on the contributor homepage. There is no mention of a need to produce professional quality pictures. It is not until one gets to the submission guidelines that there is any mention of reasons for failure and there is no longer a list of suitable cameras - just a mention of DSLR or equivalent camera which is very vague.

 

It is no surprise really to see camera owners thinking they are photographers by virtue of the fact that they own a decent camera (or even a good smartphone), as the bar has been lowered very significantly in terms of how one would define a professional quality picture in the world of digital media (i.e. a picture suitable for publication on a professional website).

 

Let's face it - photography skills are generally much less appreciated these days. I was speaking to a builder last week who had just fitted a very nice bathroom and was telling me it wasn't possible to get a photo because the space was too small. I told him that it would be no problem to me to do it and then I told him how I would do it: take several shots and merge. The lights came on and he decided he could do it himself with his phone camera which has a panorama facility. I did try to explain that I could do a far better job using a tripod, DSLR and merge on a computer but he wasn't interested. The point is that quality photography is appreciated less and less - the DIY job is sufficient. Of course I did tell him that I would be fitting my own new bathroom and would not require his services as I am now a builder with my new screwdrivers, hammer, saw and drill (not really - the consequences would be unimaginable).

At least his poor quality effort would soon disappear into the ether as he forgets to back up his images.

Yours on the other hand would be backed up and used in the future,.

I see a black hole in the making, covering the last, and next few years, after which, people will be looking for high quality images once again, and that's where we come in.

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But why would we be referring them to that page????  They shouldn't be here if they must be referred to that page!  No one said that we must explain photography basics to anyone.  If this would be on learning photography forum I would be all for it.

 

 

Sometimes it's nice to be friendly and welcoming just for the sake of being kind. People often take the time to make a post in reply to a newbie, but only to have a dig or make a sarcastic remark. It would have taken the same time to give a link to a help page. I cannot stand the unfriendliness in most forums, Facebook, Twitter, etc.. It's much better here but there are still a few who go out of their way to cause an unfriendly atmosphere.

 

We're all human, and even if someone posts a question that's obvious to most of us and may seem silly, it doesn't warrant rudeness or sarcasm. Politely pointing them in the right direction is perfectly decent and most will be appreciative of that.

 

Geoff.

 

 

I always politely tell them that they shouldn't be here.

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