need a little help from business experts!

[stipe]

Hello photographers,

I need an advice from photographers more experts than me in terms of business.

I have been shortlisted by a tourism company for realizing a photo service in Barcelona. They want 150 photos (day/night) and so they asked me my fees for the project. Particularly, they want to know my fee per photo, per hour and per day (tax excluded).

I have done a couple of photographic service for business purposes but the single companies paid me for one day of activities (half day shooting and half day editing). This looks to me something different.

What can be the range for you in order to be competitive but in the meanwhile not asking for a too low amount?

 

Thanks!

 

Stefano

[Ed Rooney]

Hopefully, you will be getting several responses from assignment photographers who are working in different areas today. I'm retired from assignment photography. But when I was shooting assignments, I had a basic way of charging that would still work today. On assignment I charged a day rate plus expenses. The least I would bill for a short job, say an hour or two, would be  half my date rate. Plus expenses. 

 

I used to do a lot of work for airlines (travel marketing) that would take a month to three months. For those jobs I would work out an overall fee . . . plus expenses. Always plus expenses, so keep all receipts. 

 

Personally, I would not dance to this client's tune and give an answer to all those numbers they want. "Thank you so much for considering me for your job. This is the way I change for my services. . . ." 

 

Bon dia, Stefano. 

[spacecadet]

The rate should also depend on the licence required- one use in one campaign would be less than a year's unlimited use, for example. But I'm sure you will get better answers.

The actual amount depends partly on your local market, but of course the images may be used worldwide, so it's not the only factor. They could go to a stock library and license images from a photographer anywhere.

[Pakodominguez]

What the assignment is about?

Photographs of the main attractions of the city?

a special event?

I used to do some work for Marsans, and once for Barceló. I preferred to charge them per day (they pay for the fees: air tickets, hotel, transfers, food...) I think is hard in this case to charge per photograph...

[Chuck Nacke]

In my opinion, the days of just a day rate + expenses are long gone.  The only real issue for billing, again in my opinion,

is the usage.  I look at overall use and length of use.  Over the last three decades my fees to corporate clients have

ranged from $1,500 a day + Expenses to $6,000 a day + Expenses.  For editorial it was usually a guarantee of $350-$600

per day + Expenses + space for each image used by the publication.  Keep in mind that most of my assignment work

for publication was done before the internet.  After the internet, there was also a fee added for web use, which could be

any where from $500.00 to $10,000 depending on the story and length of use.  On jobs where there was a considerable

length of time and travel involved I would often give the client a discount on the daily fee.  One corporate client use to

hire me for 30 to 60 days per job and it involved a lot of travel and I billed travel days at 1/2 the daily rate.

 

Another thing to keep in mind on Expenses is if the client is paying the expenses up front or are you paying for them and

then billing them.  If I am billing the client Expenses are marked up %20 for net 30 and %30 for net 60 and substantial late

fees are included in the terms of the agreement.

 

PhotoQuote is a source I have used to estimate work in the past.

 

Sorry for spellings, my browser is a mess and can't use SpellCheck.

[David Kilpatrick]

There are a few hotel/travel photographers working in Spain who sell via Alamy and may reply. From my conversations with three, I would not hold out for rates on the levels Chuck suggests - the past is a different country, and Spain is also now a different country. If you can push the rates above 500 euros a day (plus expenses) then you're doing better than some of my friends who have been forced to turn down work because the commission can't even get to that rate. It should be more like 1500 a day and allow three days' work to secure the number of pictures needed, but to be covered for one full week (7 days/nights) accommodation and travel, and allow full rights to all residuals (you show them 1000 shots, they pick 150, you keep full rights to all the rest).

[stipe]

Thanks guys for all your suggestions and comments. Well, I live in Barcelona so the only expenses I should have are public transportation unless I don't get a ride by bike!

Anyway, I replied by asking for more detailed infos. Also, I wonder if they want the 150 photos I should shoot around the city be RM exclusive or not.

I am not going to give a detailed fee for hour, photo, day, etc.

I think the best option is to ask for a total amount including shooting and editing.

[stipe]

The assignment is about shooting the best tourist places in town, even tourists or people enjoying the city. It's from a company that almost everyone uses when is about booking tourist services. Well, now you know it (almost!)

 

What the assignment is about?

Photographs of the main attractions of the city?

a special event?

I used to do some work for Marsans, and once for Barceló. I preferred to charge them per day (they pay for the fees: air tickets, hotel, transfers, food...) I think is hard in this case to charge per photograph...

[David Kilpatrick]

I've not done anything like this for a long time, but I once did the work for two tourism authorities and the deal was that they would take images from me at £25 per slide - that was, admittedly, in the 1970s! There was no bottom or top limit, I would come in with sheets of slides every month, they would pick them. That way, I could make just one sale, or twenty but the commission never ended. Benefits for me included being in touch every few weeks, so I would also be asked to do specific events. Slides were unique and not dupes, and they kept them for unlimited use (what actually happened is that one or two uses would spoil the slide, or they would project them and get them dirty or faded - they never really got a 'royalty free' deal and £25 was about a quarter of a weekly salary then).

 

You could try for a similar deal. For me, this kind of deal led to a close working relationship with one regional tourism office (Yorkshire) and one local government 'cabildo' (South Yorkshire County - a bit like Catalonia, wanted independence - that's a joke of course but not far from the truth!). I moved out of the area and that was probably the only reason this work slowed down and eventually ended.

[Chuck Nacke]

To David and All,

 

The rates I wrote about were from my own experience in a time more than a few years ago for clients

that no longer exist.  I wrote this as an example.  I am currently a member of the ASMP and was a member

of Editorial Photographers for most of the years that the organization existed before it became part of

the APA (can't remember what APA currently stands for).  Both of those organizations provide guidelines

for estimating photographic work as well as the pricing for usage of images.  I would strongly recommend

looking to one of those organizations for guidance on pricing.

[dov makabaw]

Personally I would go for a modest daily rate, probably 3 to 4 days, plus expenses but try to retain title for licensing elsewhere. Will they be defining the locations as time of day and access may create delays and additional costs as the Metro doesn't go to all the tourist spots. Central Barcelona is reasonably easy to get round so the expenses should be modest subject to how much gear you need. I suspect that they will be looking for a knock down price so you need to limit their usage and maximize on your ability to licence elsewhere. Electronic images will clearly be more cost effective than printed ones.

 

dov